Message from @Iakovos

Discord ID: 577912026223869964


2019-05-14 17:31:24 UTC  

Where is ordination in the NT?

2019-05-14 17:31:32 UTC  

Honest question.

2019-05-14 17:31:43 UTC  

Ordination is all through the Bible lmao

2019-05-14 17:31:46 UTC  

Provide aa link.

2019-05-14 17:31:52 UTC  

In the NT

2019-05-14 17:32:20 UTC  

"And he breathed the Holy Spirt on them"

2019-05-14 17:32:28 UTC  

"Upon this rock, I shall build my church"

2019-05-14 17:32:39 UTC  

That's just the first couple of bits.

2019-05-14 17:32:45 UTC  

Laying on of hands by Christ to His Apostles or the Apostles to specific members of their disciples, and the breathing of the Holy Spirit on them.

2019-05-14 17:33:11 UTC  

I think you ahve a certain distorted view of the NT

2019-05-14 17:33:22 UTC  

<:ohyou2:569616856105877505>

2019-05-14 17:33:23 UTC  

Alright, I will go and explain this to my elders and get their opinions, you have affirmed what the priest said.

2019-05-14 17:33:32 UTC  

The NT is not presented as some kind of "literally everything about divinity and priesthood"

2019-05-14 17:33:50 UTC  

Some books of the NT relate to the life of Jesus, so they talk about that

2019-05-14 17:34:04 UTC  

Others are letters to some communities, so they talk about that

2019-05-14 17:34:07 UTC  

@Mozalbete ⳩ that is why we seek Guidance.

2019-05-14 17:34:14 UTC  

Others describe revelations, etc.

2019-05-14 17:34:39 UTC  

So to study the presence of ordained priesthood you also look at many more sources that you have at your disposal

2019-05-14 17:35:24 UTC  

@Iakovos I'm curious: is Christianity based on the Bible, or on the life of Jesus Christ and the community of Believers He started?

2019-05-14 17:36:02 UTC  

Do you expect the gospels to suddenly describe the ordination of christian priests? We can see this ordination in the communities that are described, the presence of authoritative figures, the documents from the first centuries etc

2019-05-14 17:36:04 UTC  

The latter. The bible is just evidence.

2019-05-14 17:36:57 UTC  

If it's the former, how are you any different from a Muslim? If it's the latter, then isn't the Bible just a byproduct of that community? Isn't the most central Authority in Christianity the Church from which the Bible came?

2019-05-14 17:36:58 UTC  

So if we take the same verses you use, we could also conclude that we do not need any church, since we are ourselves "spiritual houses"

2019-05-14 17:37:50 UTC  

We are commanded to sing praises to the Lord, and the early churches met on the first day of the week.

2019-05-14 17:38:11 UTC  

So there is a need for a congregation for worship.

2019-05-14 17:38:26 UTC  

We can do all of those alone

2019-05-14 17:38:44 UTC  

We are commanded to take communion.

2019-05-14 17:38:52 UTC  

I'm just giving you an example how it is pointless to use that verse to pretend that we are all priests, we are all the same, nothing is restricted to us

2019-05-14 17:38:56 UTC  

Yes, but Jesus ordained specific people to lead those congregations, and He gave them specific Spiritual Gifts, including the ability to pass those gifts along through ordination.

2019-05-14 17:38:56 UTC  

In reference to way above, baptism is so essential that even non-Christians can baptized in emergencies

2019-05-14 17:39:07 UTC  

Look st St. Genesius

2019-05-14 17:39:33 UTC  

So now you have to tur not only to the Bible, but to everything ever written by those people in that chain of ordination going back to Christ.

2019-05-14 17:39:52 UTC  

If your pastor is not in that chain, or has broken from it, you have a problem.

2019-05-14 17:40:51 UTC  

I'll think about it and pray for guidance.

2019-05-14 17:41:06 UTC  

I don't think the things we mention are unreasonable

2019-05-14 17:41:37 UTC  

You say elders, are you JW or LDS?

2019-05-14 17:41:59 UTC  

I mean, we are called to be priests, as in performing these spiritual sacrifices, as the priests after Moses took care of the sacrifices

2019-05-14 17:42:06 UTC  

Neither. JW's are heretics.

2019-05-14 17:42:12 UTC  

Church of Christ.

2019-05-14 17:42:16 UTC  

But it is natural and normal to have a hierarchy in the Church

2019-05-14 17:42:17 UTC  

What is LDS?