Message from @Mozalbete ⳩
Discord ID: 577921438447829003
Maybe your tradition of men added those parts :^)
Perhaps you're being deceived by demons by forbidding marriage :^)
1 Timothy 4:1-4
**1 Timothy 4:1-4 - New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)**
```Dust
False Asceticism
<1> Now the Spirit expressly says that in later times some will renounce the faith by paying attention to deceitful spirits and teachings of demons, <2> through the hypocrisy of liars whose consciences are seared with a hot iron. <3> They forbid marriage and demand abstinence from foods, which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth. <4> For everything created by God is good, and nothing is to be rejected, provided it is received with thanksgiving; ```
Sure the demon of Paul when he says how abstinence and virginity is the mostdesirable thing lmao
You are free to marry
Then, you just don't become a priest
Choosing abstinence is different than forbidding. We see that Bishops were married, so let them marry.
You choose to be a priest lmao
But bishops had children.
Lol "traditions of men" says the prot with a 150 year old tradition using a knee capped version of a book given to him by the Catholics.
How many of them after they became bishops
?
@OrthoBro yes, let me just say screw the bible and forbid bishops to marry.
Peter was married.
Do you really think Jerome would have written what he wrote if that had been the rule?
And did he go to his family to have sex with his wife and have children?
@Iakovos we have historical records of bishops going back to the 12 Apostles. These are real things you can look at in museums and churches. Do you know how many of them were married to a living person at the time of their ordination?
>imagine separating tradition and scripture
Right. Bishops were married.
It is normal to ask for abstinence when being in a position that requires dedication to God and taking care of the Church.
If the bible was self-evident interpretation wise there wouldn't be 3000+ Protestant denominations
The great Protestant experiment failed, give it up
In the times then, sure, Christianity was emerging, the pool of people was small, so at least you ask that someone hasn't been practising polygamy
But we can see that it was mainstream that if someone was married prior to being a bishop, he would abandon conjugal rights
Those Bishops and early Christian's were looking at the same Scripture you are, but also participating the the living Body of Christ's Church. Unbelievably few of them were married, and all of them under very specific circumstances. Many Bishops were widowers, which is not the same thing.
It's almost as though those Christians operating with more information than us ended up practicing celibacy once they became Bishops.
On purpose.
I'll talk about it with a priest. Right now I am unconvinced and I trust the Lord my God to guide me to the Truth, so that my soul will be tucked away with Him and be written in the Book of Life.
I will also consult my elders.
When in doubt, it is a nice idea to see if there was a very prominent idea in the earliest Church
Calling clerical celibacy "traditions of men" is in itself a tradition of men
It doesn't have to be strictly decisive, but if you see there are many writtings against a position, explicitely and clearly, it should be something to consider
Also, when in doubt, BEGOME ORDODOGS :DDD
Orthobro, do your priests marry?
And have children
We just ask for this discipline, ONLY for a positon of special holyness, that requires special dedication. It is pointless to say that we cant have this requirement as if it contradicted a verse that refers to forbidding marriage, when people are free to not to pursue this position
It says in the previous chapter that bishops have wives and children. It never changes the subject.
Orthodox have married priest though I don't know the detail. Orthobro said up above that the Bishops are pulled from celibates
Do any of you understand my hesitation?
I can see why the passage would be confusing without historical context yes