Holy shit... 😲😲😲😲

Was it that people used to believe Helen of Troy was the real reason behind the Trojan war, or was it that people didn't realize that Troy was an actual place that existed, and just assumed that it was a story that someone dreamed up?

I think it was sort of both

Countless reenactments focus on the romance between Paris and Helen and not on the circumstances surrounding the war itself

and until Troy was located archeologically, people just assumed it was just a myth

@wolfman1911
Both. In fact, Heinrich SCHLIEMANN didn't actually find Troy, but rather a later city...
And there was no Helen.

So it was Karen of Troy then?

Yeah, the whole thing was actually started by her wanting to talk to Greece's manager.

Becky of troy

So the composer for Skyrim and several other big name games has been accused of raping an employee 10 years ago. Meaning unless Bethesda breaks precedent and stands with him, odds are he'll be dropped like a sack of potatoes without so much as a police report filed.

I think that we should have a standard, that if you verifiably falsely accuse someone incorrectly, you should at minimum face half the sentence that individual would face.

Gee, I wonder if *anything* like that has *ever* been suggested... /Sardonic.

Why not the full sentence the accused would have faced?

*"Gee, I wonder if* anything *even remotely like that has* ever *been suggested* before. /Sardonic.

If I could throw out a new debate topic:
Aside from the 6 or so aging Nazis war fugitives that are still alive from the 1930's Germany, there are no Nazis anymore. The people that called Nazis nowadays aren't actually Nazis, it's a red herring.
Nazism, officially the National Socialist German Workers' Party, died when Germany was defeated in World War I. Only surviving members of the National Socialist German Workers' are still Nazis and should be called and labeled Nazis, unless they intentionally denounce the ideology.
White-Nationalists or far-right, ethno-national, extremists or what have you, should not be called or labeled or considered Nazis as it:
A. cheapens the atrocities done by the actual National Socialist German Workers' Party in the 30's-40's and
B. is factually and historically inaccurate.

Despite the rigid dogma I've previously manifested, I'm 100% open to someone changing my mind on this, on points A or B individually or both.

Well, the first one is actually kind of a moot point imo

why

People still call themselves actual Stalinists and communists despite the atrocities caused by those ideologies

And people who are proud to label themselves neo-Nazis aren't exactly unheard of, either

distinction:

Nazi is not a person, Stalin is a person so you can call yourself a Stalinist if you worship what Stalin said/did

nazi is a specific location and time that is now gone

To add, how many people go around unironically wearing Che T-shirts despite his actions in life

Nazism is a fusion of ideologies though, if you can name it that, the same way Stalinism is a specifc take on communism

I'm saying no calls themself a Hitler-ist which is stupid sounding but fine

I’ve seen a feminist say that the victims of the holodomor deserved it

I couldn’t tell if she was joking

Since she is absolutely hysterical

Because Hitler never made himself the core of his movement, per se, whereas Stalin made moves to create himself as the center in order to combat Trotskyism

There's a reason we use the names of those two vs Hitlerism

which afaik doesn't exist in common use

Because Hitler expressed his views through Nazism; they were practically inseparable

In the same vein, no one ever calls themselves a Mussolinist

well this all sounds like semantics to me though, are you saying that my argument is just semantics?

There was a distinct difference between Stalin vs Trotsky outside of "hail leader"

because if you are are, that's not a counter argument to what I said

Not quite, I'm saying that the ideologies (or strains thereof) were named due to distinct policy/execution differences

and that people follow those based on their values

I don't think it "cheapens" anything when adherents to said ideologies (or strains thereof) wish to repeat those atrocities should they manage to grab power again

We've had people in this server call for forced concentration of Jews in Israel, and subsequent nuking of the place

Wouldn't it be accurate to call that Nazism, as such?