@!dammnation3(Liberalist) "Have you even READ loche" haha goddamn that's such a stupid thing to say.

You don't have an argument, just a condescending tone, that's it.

Now the idea that you presented, that speaking truth to power is how we get our wants and needs protected, that's not necessarily true.

when did i ever ask about reading philosphy books?

What if what you want is not what you need, what if you don't know what you need?

What if you're a communist? They need LESS freedom.

@Benedict XVII Well what I mean by good is in a more universalistic sense the "Extrapolation of the universe". There's a term, agape, that I think expresses this really well.

It's the love that god has for mankind, the desire to see the universe fulfilled within us essentially.

ah, agape. I've been through enough catholic school to know what that means

I think the fulfillment of the universe, reaching the potential that we have and ever increasing our potential as an expression of universal will itself is "Good".

which is why liberalistism is a faulty ideology that is dumbo's first "philosophy"

well wouldn't expanded personal freedoms allow people to reach that potential easier?

not necessarily.

Personal freedoms, from what?

moreso than no personal freedoms

from state tyranny

State tyranny? Sure.

How about gender?

Freedom from work?

if people are allowed to operate in their own interests as they see fit, then they get to determine what their own potential is and reach it.

Freedom from genetic disadvantage due to your background?

freedom from other people doing harmful stuff to you. Now what stuff is harmful is another discussion

well its positive rights vs. negative rights

Well

what if you're a communist?

harmful stuff should happen to you.

communists are ideologically wrong, but political belief doesn't justify violence

Why not?

What if they're about to be voted into power?

Civil war is violence.

put the shoe on the other foot, "what if you're a fascist, harmful stuff should happen to you"

Should we not have gone into civil war against the south to destroy slavery?

ok. "What if you believe in slavery, should bad stuff happen to you?"

We shouldn't have invaded the south, just let them have slaves.

@Ape, as a Catholic, I agree. I think that we can say God is good. And so conforming to God's will is good. So our actions ought to conform to God's will. But, I'm curious, how do you think we ought to conform ourselves to God's will?

if they try to instate slavery, and forcibly enslave other people, then yes

then its self defense

Communists are trying to instate communism, and forcibly enslave other people. So while violence against individuals may be beyond the pale, institutional discrimination against communist groups is simply the logical result.

I believe preemptively harming them is not the answer

yup, and i agree with what you have just said, ape.

what is your point?