*called it and suffered because of it*

*along with his ideology*

@Alpha Is one country bigger or another smaller?

yes

Than there are differences. What other differences do you know?

size and strenght

that

Is there more people in NK or USSR?

USSR i think.. but dude what is your point?

Point is to use abstractions to see the differences in the socialist countries. To have a better knowledge about them. Knowledge is necessary.

Just saying free market is the best known to man

If we stay on the topic we can proceed with getting knowledge about the subject that you picked.

If you are interested.

alan, just because the anglo-american capitalist empire is extremely powerful does not make it right

when it comes to political theory, might does not make right

but in raw politics, sometimes the opposite is the case

i dont like american capitalist

they have their own agenda

but thats the thing, what we read in the west about venezuela is inflected by capitalist propaganda

@Alpha We have to compare socialist countries with socialist. To know the differences in their systems.

we see the nation through the lens of their (capitalist) interests

agree

but the free market is necessary you can have socialism. but also free market

well I don't disagree with that necessarily

socialists usually call it "free association"

Lets not change the subject please as we didn't find any knowledge yet on the previous subject. Would you like to investigate on the differences of socialist states?

because "markets" are taken to imply

that there are still financial markets, ownership of stocks/bonds/commodities by indiviiduals

@Firefly i can do that later

my point is

@Alpha I'll wait.

I'll be here

For you.

that with pure socialism you cant go so far

Alan this piece by Schweickart is pretty close to what a good "transitional program" should be....and strictly speaking its a kind of market socialism

http://www.thenextsystem.org/economic-democracy/

but imho any socialist alternative has to address the problems with capitalism that schweickart brings up