Message from @mcstubbs

Discord ID: 442193093412782080


2018-05-05 05:10:09 UTC  

@mcstubbs Like on the russian front?

2018-05-05 05:10:13 UTC  

and a lot of immediate postwar memoirs available in the us were written by german generals acquitted of warcrimes

2018-05-05 05:10:15 UTC  

yep.

2018-05-05 05:10:33 UTC  

@mcstubbs 20 mil was an official statistic formulated after the war, but a number of scholars have actually claimed that number isn't correct as it didn't accurately identify all those that actually died nor did it account for the missing POW's/MIA service members. Some say it may have been as many as 40 mil.

2018-05-05 05:10:43 UTC  

and the us bought into it because heck, we thought we were gonna be fightin' the commies next and we needed to know how they worked

2018-05-05 05:11:03 UTC  

yeah, i believe it. soviet documents are a clusterfuck

2018-05-05 05:11:40 UTC  

@mcstubbs Ehh, sounds more like banter and big talk, it is hard to say for certain, but it certainly dosen't match up with fucking removing people from history, forging historical documents, and outright lying.

2018-05-05 05:12:07 UTC  

@mcstubbs And, what do you mean about the german post war memoirs?

2018-05-05 05:12:12 UTC  

oh yeah, i just meant from a standpoint of analyzing casualty counts and the like

2018-05-05 05:13:02 UTC  

well, a lot of western understanding of the eastern front comes from these memoirs, which tend to paint wehrmacht actions in a very positive light compared to the soviets.

2018-05-05 05:13:03 UTC  

also

2018-05-05 05:13:06 UTC  

fun game

2018-05-05 05:13:22 UTC  

check out the casualty counts in this article. none of the historians can agree.

2018-05-05 05:13:37 UTC  

this was one of the largest army operations in the whole war

2018-05-05 05:13:45 UTC  

and documents are *shit*

2018-05-05 05:15:27 UTC  

@mcstubbs The whermact really didn't have much belief backing their operations as opposed to the SS, they were more like the general military than anything, while the SS were the paramilitary wing of the nazi party, and also had an offensive wing which involved itself in every war nazi germany was in, the SS who weren't waffen on the offensive were guards.

2018-05-05 05:16:13 UTC  

yeah, the SS were definitely more politically driven than the wehrmacht heer

2018-05-05 05:17:11 UTC  

Some of the whermact actually attempted to have hitler assassinated several times, none succeeding.

2018-05-05 05:17:24 UTC  

So it makes sense why they would be acquited.

2018-05-05 05:17:29 UTC  

valkyrie being the most famous and close to success IIRC

2018-05-05 05:17:46 UTC  

there was some compliance in war crimes though

2018-05-05 05:18:02 UTC  

manstein, for example, was a pretty dedicated nazi

2018-05-05 05:18:37 UTC  

the army helped round up Jews for the concentration camps and the various decrees made by Hitler that 'allowed' the German military to 'legally' commit war crimes.

2018-05-05 05:18:50 UTC  

They sounded committed enough to natsoc ideology to me

2018-05-05 05:20:06 UTC  

most historians agree actually

2018-05-05 05:20:17 UTC  

@When Things Aren't Right Go Left I think the SS actually played the biggest role in that.

2018-05-05 05:20:30 UTC  

the wehrmacht were definitely compliant

2018-05-05 05:20:47 UTC  

But then again, most details around the holocaust are foggy, and conflicting.

2018-05-05 05:23:16 UTC  

Okay?

2018-05-05 05:23:23 UTC  

The Wehrmacht is recognized by every reputable historian as a perpetrator of genocide.

2018-05-05 05:23:31 UTC  
2018-05-05 05:23:43 UTC  

What do historians matter to me?

2018-05-05 05:24:41 UTC  

That's a good question

2018-05-05 05:25:13 UTC  

And are you going to continue with that comment?

2018-05-05 05:25:43 UTC  

I don't know what you think

2018-05-05 05:26:16 UTC  

i just got 11 ground kills in an il-2 on korea on war thunder without so much as seeing an enemy aircraft.

2018-05-05 05:26:17 UTC  

ama.

2018-05-05 05:26:40 UTC  

What I am stating is that I don't care about some historians who claim that what they think is unquestionabale, and anybody who does question their beliefs is automatically wrong.

2018-05-05 05:26:56 UTC  

i don't think they're being dogmatic about it