Numbers prove it correct, you cannot have an infinite amount of matter and energy.

theres an infite amount or numbers

It makes everying fail.

Because there's the matter of the unknown.

@NinjaQuick prove that it does

As said, numbers can lie at extremes.

Infinite energy means infinite entropy means the universe can't exist.

who says that energy is used all at once?

But the *apparent* laws indicate finite energy.

It doesn't matter, given enough infinity, it is inescapable.

As a result of said entropic cascade.

Infinitely in one direction over time negates entropy

Infinite is infinite, it is an irrational open ended value

You can't, infinite is irrational, it isn't pouring more in all the time

(See what I said about extremes.. don't get more extreme than infinite.)

Infinite always was and always will be

It's kinda like c.

And it is always as infinite then and now.

And accelerating matter past it.

So you can't have an infinite universe.

everything that is is always until its not forever

But I must still caveat such is apparent.

I won't caveat it, the universe is necessarily finite. And like I said, that's the matter and energy being finite.

Because there's always a chance that we just don't have the ability to perceive different rulesets thay we don't know.

And once we say science is settled, it is no longer science.

If we consider it is finite, but has to exist

Then I would say there's a *beyond*

The universe is conceptual, concepts aren't finite, therefore the universe is not either.

It really just boils down to what you are claiming the universe to be.

Eh, a concept can describe a finite element.

what is in the space between atoms?

I don't consider whatever the *beyond* might be to be universe.

As you mentioned, a threshold of somesort.

Like I said, the universe is a bubble expanding in an infinite *beyond*.

But that's just a layterm

The "expanding" isn't really true since there's nothing or something or all of it or none of it *beyond*

(Indescribable, but we're talking the extreme edges where human reasoning *cannot*)

Like, I subscribe to reality being an all at once type of thing.

there are infite bubbles in the bubble

The universe is starting and dying in this moment.

Possible, but then that breaks from universe (ours) to multiverse. @JaIsCool