Of matter and energy

Ah, so you're using that working definition. Good to know.

Except for dark matter and quantum mechanics

those dont follow our proposed rules

We live in a society.

Yes, because it's nonsense to try to say what could exist beyond spacetime.

I 'unno anymore, Goodwood.

The mores have disintegrated.

Yall must've never done LSD

Simply put, there's *beyond*, and our reality, the shit we can measure, interact with, observe.

*beyond* shouldn't be considered part of the universe, nor reality, it just is, and the universe is all the matter and energy.

And other goodies.

NQ is claiming what I said as well - the *unknown*, *unknowable* and *known*.

and it exists only in our minds... which are part of the universe.

We can't say time or space or anything like that exist beyond, just that there is a part that is universe, and a part that isn't. The isn't is infinite

The concept of the unknowable doesn't make it anymore knowable.

The is has to be finite.

Numbers prove this incorrect

It's a fair, but unconfirmable concept.

Numbers prove it correct, you cannot have an infinite amount of matter and energy.

theres an infite amount or numbers

It makes everying fail.

Because there's the matter of the unknown.

@NinjaQuick prove that it does

As said, numbers can lie at extremes.

Infinite energy means infinite entropy means the universe can't exist.

who says that energy is used all at once?

But the *apparent* laws indicate finite energy.

It doesn't matter, given enough infinity, it is inescapable.

As a result of said entropic cascade.

Infinitely in one direction over time negates entropy

Infinite is infinite, it is an irrational open ended value

You can't, infinite is irrational, it isn't pouring more in all the time

(See what I said about extremes.. don't get more extreme than infinite.)

Infinite always was and always will be

It's kinda like c.

And it is always as infinite then and now.

And accelerating matter past it.

So you can't have an infinite universe.

everything that is is always until its not forever

But I must still caveat such is apparent.