Is a baby sentient? When is that determined?

To know when something starts you must first be able to define it

I am speaking in the aggregate here

We cannot define sentience, let alone intelligence

Are those who are cripplingly retarded sentient

@Marushia Dark That is absolutely incorrect. We have absolutely no way of testing for the sentience of a fetus.

TBH the correct argument would be abortion OK before 4 years because they have no memory until 4 years

@Hexidecimark can't we?

In a limited way. Like most things. Especially on here. It is a spectrum

and that's post birth abortion

Binary thinkers cannot understand

I seriously don't see the difference between killing a fetus and killing a 3 year old

What I’m saying is that it’s impossible for any kind of sentience to exist before 4 weeks, as there is no brain for that sentience to reside in.

After four weeks, we just can’t know. Err on the side of not-murder.

We really can't

If we could find a singular definition for either they'd both be simpler to recreate mechanically

Laws allow very little wiggle room, it's illegal or legal, things can be legal and immoral or illegal and moral, but the legality of the issue is what we are discussing, so we must be precise and binary to that end

I often say that the law can't rule on what science and philosophy can't answer. If we can't tell what is sentience and when it occurs, then it's morally ambiguous

typically it takes 2 weeks to find out if youre pregnant via tests

Aside from Joker, were there any good movies this year?

@Marushia Dark I think ShimSham has you here

The last jedi was pretty funny

so.. that leaves max 2 weeks to abort... which doesnt seem right

@Marushia Dark And so, id rather err on the side of not murdering someone.

I literally just agreed with him, Roe

@ShimShamWhamBam that was 2017 not 2019

or easy

Consciousness is the biproduct of a of a working brain. A property like H20's "wetness".

Nope

@Marushia Dark He literally isn't even arguing with your small brained position

@Win Roe wow that felt like yesterday

IKR

it's because it's so bad people are still finding things to dislike about it

Lol

It is an emergent property

You can have a working neural system without consciousness

watching breaking bad first time through and saul goodman is the best

tbh

@Caeser true

lol yea

But, again, any legislation would be aimed at doctors, not mothers.

It would be illegal for a doctor to *provide* an abortion.

It wouldn’t be illegal for a mother to seek one.