From Rumi's perspective, you can.

that makes the symbolism more relevant since rumi was born later than ghazali

More recent may not be more relevant. Also, forgive me, but it is easier to re-purpose someone's work once he cannot defend himself. I am not sure was Ghazali would have thought of this.

i totally agree but i was talking about how it is relevant to me and the intent of making my nickname, since that's subjectively about how i interpret the philosophies of each of two

sometimes the urge of connecting the works of thinkers with interpreting them in a way that was totally unintended by those thinkers comes so strong

when you spend so much time thinking on their ideas, you know

Oh, that's fair. Now I know, huh. I really like Ghazali so far.

i'm proud if i had a piece of influence towards your interest in muslim philosophers with that conversation we had a while ago

they truly are groundbreaking, especially when you're so used to western philo with being exposed to them all the time

Aristotle was a mistake.

huh, tell me about it

though he has a special role in human 'mentality' timeline with inducing a way of thinking, especially about science and morals

I suppose it is what it is. But there is a tension between religion and Aristotle which had to be resolved. It is foolish to pretend that Aristotle was only wrong in areas which do not effect philosophy of religion.

This was not fully understood and resolved in the West until Kant, which is relatively recent by comparison.

i don't think anyone would care or we would talk about it right now if he hasn't had such a big influence in the world for a long time, and with influence i mean literally dogmas, so like that's not entirely his fault in my opinion

That's true. There was just a conceptual vacuum at the time which the Hellenistic world filled.

and as much as wrong he was, as i said, he is the one that came up with some new ideas that made humankind realize the concept of 'thinking' about those possible

yeah

but it is truly a shame that nicomachean ethics influenced the christian mentality so much, which got to be dominant in the world later on

In the end, all philosophy is there to help us to try and think about God and other things. It is dangerous to get too involved in philosophy from a religious standpoint which may outweigh what is written in religious books like the Bible or Quran.

This is also a problem in the Church. Fashionable philosophy at each time shape the future rulings of the whole faith.

isn't that what basically happened to you? too much philosophy and the concept of critical thinking made you a heretic at the end hahaha?

Catholics, the largest denomination, are still entrenched in scholasticism and logic, which is perilous and for me was a big source of terror.

Yes.

i totally agree

Even so, even if you could 100% show that God exists and so on, it is still not a replacement for faith and internalisation of it in practice.

The role of reason is to give faith a justification, if there are doubts. It is a small medicine from a spiritual point of view.

although the wrong/corrupted dogmas in religions are what makes guys like kierkegaard and nietzsche great philosopher of all things and made us get to know them, if we were too look at the full half of the glass

Yes, nihilism brought me much darkness.But it also made me realise the value of meaning.

if you a nihilist

fo ssee a psychiatrist

unless you are a fake nihilst

The supreme value is God and through Him immortality. I know this now. But now I had to undo much thought habits.

in which case fuck you

Too much intellect has left my soul barren.

so you could solve the ultimate dilemma and reach god through pure logic?

Not pure logic, more dialectic.

how do you call it a value then and how can you fathom the idea?

If you are solely rational and only see that the material world exists, you get to a point where you see that all events are the same, all meaning is the same, or that there is no ultimate meaning. You have to move forward from this point of nihilism. Then you realise all you have is yourself and what makes it up. Your body continues to life. How to find meaning now, when everything material will one day all be gone? What is the point? etc.

You are damned but you are free from ultimate responsibility in this situation.

But to move forward, you have to make your own meaning somewhere.