Message from @quiscalus

Discord ID: 387534543470723072


2017-12-05 09:19:01 UTC  

I've been a Marxist for a few years now and am intimately familiar with various schools of thought, such as Austrolibertarianism and Keynesianism.

2017-12-05 09:19:28 UTC  

I had to educate and annihilate an Ancap the other day.

2017-12-05 09:19:45 UTC  

that's another thing

2017-12-05 09:19:52 UTC  

whatever you do, don't become an anarchist

2017-12-05 09:20:01 UTC  

their rhetoric sounds nice, their policies not so

2017-12-05 09:20:06 UTC  

because well

2017-12-05 09:20:08 UTC  

they have none

2017-12-05 09:20:09 UTC  

He assumed that because I was a Marxist, I hadn't read guys like Menger, Von Mises, Hayek and Rothbard. He was sorely mistaken.

2017-12-05 09:20:20 UTC  

yeah I used to be a 19yo anprim and read zerzan and TK but I think it is a bit absurd

2017-12-05 09:20:38 UTC  

Anprim is complete and utter garbage.

2017-12-05 09:20:50 UTC  

i'm still gonna tell you though

2017-12-05 09:21:00 UTC  

i wouldn't read exclusively leftist ideology

2017-12-05 09:21:05 UTC  

i would read from both sides

2017-12-05 09:21:09 UTC  

that's what i did

2017-12-05 09:21:20 UTC  

I read have been on leftypol for a while but it is not a very good climate to introduce ideas because they think giving people a PDF and saying they don't want to spoon feed people, but I think if you want to attract the general public the left needs to make things easier and more accessible

2017-12-05 09:21:21 UTC  

choose what sounds the best

2017-12-05 09:21:36 UTC  

Read into Neoclassical and Austrian theory, but first make sure you're well grounded in Marxism.

2017-12-05 09:22:08 UTC  

I read some austrian economics stuff when I was younger

2017-12-05 09:22:40 UTC  

is stuff like jacobin good because that is what the local DSA is promoting in their reading group

2017-12-05 09:22:56 UTC  

Marxists.org is a highly valuable resource to further your knowledge. You won't have to spend a time to educate yourself on theory that way.

2017-12-05 09:23:55 UTC  

I only ready the super short communist manifesto which is interesting I am just not sure about a command economy because I have yet to see a functional one historically

2017-12-05 09:24:22 UTC  

The DSA is really nothing more than the radical wing of the Democratic Party.

2017-12-05 09:24:30 UTC  

how do you know what is good theory is there a way to test the validity of one mode of thought over another?

2017-12-05 09:24:55 UTC  

And Jacobin puts out good stuff on occasion but for the most part they are pretty liberal.

2017-12-05 09:25:09 UTC  

yeah I mainly approach the left because I am motivated by a moral philosophy that I think fits pretty well with it

2017-12-05 09:25:39 UTC  

Just examine the results of the practical application of a given theory in the historical record.

2017-12-05 09:26:39 UTC  

yeah that's why I question anarchism because it appears every manifestation of leftism on a large scale seems to meet a violent end from outside nations unless they have a military

2017-12-05 09:26:48 UTC  

For example, the command-style economy of the USSR effectively transformed a backwater, semi-feudal nation into an industrialized superpower in just a few decades.

2017-12-05 09:27:23 UTC  

It's almost mind-boggling.

2017-12-05 09:27:45 UTC  

yeah I think they could have done that will out all the social repression but that is just my opinion on the matter

2017-12-05 09:28:20 UTC  

now i don't mean to start an argument here, but has marxism ever been attempted at all?

2017-12-05 09:28:22 UTC  

yeah both china and russia were transformed from dramatically poor agrarian societies to modern wealthy educated industrial ones in a very short time

2017-12-05 09:28:48 UTC  

I am not super well read but based on the outline in the communist manifesto I think not

2017-12-05 09:30:09 UTC  

One thing you have to understand is that they were literally surrounded by capitalo-imperialist nations whose mission was to crush what they perceived as a fundamental threat to their way of life. In the early years of the socialist experiment in Russia, 7 foreign powers sent in armies in an attempt to stop the Bolsheviks in their tracks.

2017-12-05 09:30:18 UTC  

has there ever been a command economy with democratic representation? didn't the soviet state replace capitalists with bureaucrats who controlled production, distribution, etc?

2017-12-05 09:30:53 UTC  

They failed. I suggest you look into Soviet Democracy, which was a form of Direct-Democracy.

2017-12-05 09:31:00 UTC  

that is true every state trying to achieve leftist aims faces opposition from other forces

2017-12-05 09:31:47 UTC  

shit look and thomas sankara france murdered him pretty quickly to reestablish control of the former colony even in the 80s

2017-12-05 09:32:06 UTC  

The USSR did manage to create a socialist economy after the NEP and prior to its collapse due to capitalist influence after Stalin's death.

2017-12-05 09:32:33 UTC  

is it possible to have a socialist state with a powerful enough military to hold out against outside forces while preserving human rights?

2017-12-05 09:33:08 UTC  

Was it ideal? Of course not. The conditions were not ripe for the kind of socialism Marx predicted would come about in advanced, capitalist nations in the West. But nonetheless it was socialist at one point.