Message from @P14
Discord ID: 363210647212916736
have to make a phone call back in 2 minutes.
kk
only reason i can think of for atheists being the least tribal is that most are left-leaning
and therefore all about that equality
Going left is really just reorganizing the tribes. If anything I would argue they are more tribal, not less. Modern Christianity is unique in the way it satiates the tribal instinct without being destructive.
Well, here we are again. Atheism clearly isn‘t a belief system and we all seem to agree that some kind of belief system is necessary. My initial thought was that they are less tribal, because they don‘t have a religion to look at as their tribe, but again. Atheism is not a belief system, it matters what people adopt instead of the belief in god and then we can look if they are more or less tribal.
Also we would habe to take a look at what tribalism really means.
I personally don‘t think tribalism is of great importance in this debate. The important thing about religion is mindset. And I would again point out that christians have a rather weak mindset generally speaking. This is not based on religious text or church doctrine and history, but rather on how christians behave today.
Yeah, this is basically my point. It's not entirely clear that a "athiest" society that didn't adopt a different belief system would be stable at all. The question is does the substituted belief system inherently require some sort of metaphysical or supernatural foundation to be effective in that role. I'm not sure it doesn't.
Exactly, if we can have a belief system, that doesn‘t need to lie to it‘s believers, that would be great.
If we look at the debate between Christianity vs Nordic Paganism, I would say we are mainly talking about testosterone. Christianity keeps testosterone in check, while Paganism let‘s it reign free. At least this holds true in the general interpretations. A thing right in the middle would be great, but I don’t think we have found that yet.
This also shows that science and religion are mostly conflicting.
I never said they didn't conflict. I just said that it doesn't take away from the fact that it's the backbone of western society.
Yeah, the others said that though.
Oh.
The problem is that religion is not sustainable in the long term, because people will see through the lies
I don't necessarily think of them as lies.
Well, but people do
That‘s what matters
To be sure, there are liars in the ranks, but the belief system itself is sincere.
And has a "truth" of it's own kind.
Atheism has increased rapidly since the scientific revolution.
I don't think so. It's far from the obvious for most people. At least in the US.
Well look at Europe
Actualy I think athiesm recently declined here.
What?
Don't quote me on that, I seem to remember seeing something recently.
Oh, atheists dont get a lot of kids?
That may be
No, just the pecentage of people that self identify on census and surveys and such.
Hmm
Maybe it was just a certain age group.
Or demographic.
Maybe because of the immigrants
There are a lot of credulous people out there.
And even with all the progress that been made in science, the vast majority of Americans are still religious.
And a good percentage of those I would consider "devout".
Yes, but they are becoming more secular.
So it's far from obvious that it's a natural position to hold.
It does not happen that fast, it takes a few generations.
There's something about the ideal of god, an entity that represents all of society's most revered traits and ethics, that seems almost necessary for a society to function.