Personally, I may not believe in a literal deity or God, but I'm sure as hell not going to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

@Fitzydog Do you know how the moral value of truth engrained in Europe 3000 years ago if you can't teach someone to value truth?

I was more general, but the problems with new atheism and sjwism are symptomatic of the same societal problems that lead to the atrocities of the 20th century.

@codenamecam Well.... Greek philosophy and a desire for truth above all else, seeking a rational explanation for all things regardless of the 'sacredness'. Nothing is off limits.

I will be frank. Athiesm split into 2 factions. The ones who replace the church for science 1 for 1, and the Athiesm+ with idiology in the place of church

both sects are simply filling the void with something else

@codenamecam If you asked an Islamic scholar to write a teleological proof that God exists, he'd probably cut your head off.

big

Best answer is that you cant

A belief is a belief

Some things cant be known.

That doesn't stop Catholic philosophers from trying.

True

It's encouraged

Well I like seeing theologicians try

I just cant see it being done

Christianity always had the opening to understand the world and god. Islam doesnt

to probe the world is to slight against allah.

The important part is that it is ENCOURAGED. That's the strive for truth

I miss the golden age of islam @Fitzydog

“Golden age”

@MountainMan I don't think it ever existed

Hell most of the *science* of the golden age bs wasnt even islamic people. It was jews and other ideologies who lived in islamic countries and payed their theology tax

It was just 'golden' in comparison to the Dark Ages in europe

A golden age in comparison to the rest is still golden

The Dark Ages really werent *that* dark

@radeon can we bury the hatchet

even though its shite in comparison to now

I will admit to trolling weed

and it was mostly translations of the greeks, romans, and babylonic shizz.

It was more or less the equivilent to the great depression

eith the plague to boot

But you got a bit too sensitive about it

But yea Islam mostly took from older nations, or non muslim scholars

European society invented everything: Fact.

All the *golden age* was, was their age of conquest

Some things were asian inventions but most were euro

@Fitzydog if anyone argues against that they must be delusional

Welcome to university lol

Asians created gunpowder and it made the way via silk road to Europe

What's interesting is from anthropology archeology in Britain Roman commoners were actually less healthy than post Roman Romano British. They believe it's because the post romans had to forage and hunt instead of eating the common agricultural crops of the roman age, which had mineral deficiencies.