Yeah just for recoded I never claimed no fraud just not mass fraud or more fraud than you would expect from any other election

@samwisegamgee77 I think Sidney Powell and her Dominion conspiracy theory actually muddied the water for Trump. It's bonkers and can be easily disproven. The GA hand recount should have ended derailed that crazy train, but she and Rudy keep doubling down and why not... people are believing it, because they've been conditioned to accept fraud.

That theory would never hold up under scrutiny,
Too many moving parts.

Which one?

I dont disagree with that completely, I am just very suspect of the way much of MSM and social media has been so incredibly one sided in this. Which leads me to believe some of the taboo "conspiracy" as holding some weight. Also because of how the entire Russia disinformation, Flynn indictment, impeachment BS, and everything was very orchestrated by nefarious actors in high places.

Each echo chamber has been one-sided based on their target audience. The RWM was certain Trump was going to win and amplified his claims.

Dominion system was rigged theory. Hand recount tally’s up,
Nothing to it.

Agreed.

I have followed it since the very beginning. Every single hearing, every leak to the press, on Russia. Ukraine being handled the same way, and protecting the insider, Biden. I didnt vote for trump in 2016 because I never took him or his message seriously.

But after watching and waiting and scratching my head, and watching and waiting and reading some more. People have called trump racist bigoted, etc and I really think that couldn't be farther from the truth.

Hasn’t every conservatives candidate been called that since forever

Mainly because they tend to get support form the racist types

Which trump had in spades

He plays footsie with the racists on far right. Just as biden does with antifa. Well Biden thinks he does but antifa actually love Bernie.

I grew to enjoy watching him be attacked from every single angle and keep on keeping on and pushing what he believes is the best path forward. And I tend to agree with the positions he takes on things. And the more he gets attacked for every little thing and never gets credit for anything, the more I grow to love how he just keeps pushing the same exact message he has from day 1

Hell, from 30 years ago with Rosanne he had the same message

Which message is that?

I think they are mutually exclusive. I agree with you that Trump was treated poorly and probably unfairly by the MSM, but he started things off with the Fake News angle going back to the Birther movement. He never stopped calling them Fake and they went out of their way to paint him in a bad light. I do not think there was collusion with the Russians, but they did aid him (in order to destabilize the US confidence in elections. If Trump had been the favorite, they would have helped Clinton.)

I think his transition team plus Don Jr were naïve and inexperienced. They met with the Russians and didn't report it - not knowing that they were supposed to. They did lie about it - which could be considered entrapment from their perspective - but they should have come clean. The more they denied, the more the press and the left smelled blood. It was stupid and I'm sure the Russians had many a laugh over it.

I agree @TaLoN132 but I also feel there was more to the collusion.

Talon, I think we think and analyze things very similarly

Not literally Trump calling Putin on the phone...but he did publicly ask a-foreign nation to hack a sitting Member of the Cabinet.

I do go back and forth on what I believe as I find out solid information

@samwisegamgee77, you just advanced to level 6!

Adam, please explain

Are you open to some research on Russian collusion?

Yes, very much so

We are definitely taking this channel a little off base, but I'm down to side track as long as it dont bother others in the group on this channel

I Personally had discredited the report coming out of X-British spy who was supposedly linked to the Clintons...but recently found that some irregularities definitely occurred that could amount to collusion.

Sam, if you can watch this...

https://www.hbo.com/video/documentaries/agents-of-chaos/videos/trailer

I enjoyed the Apprentice... It wasn't great business-wise, but it was entertaining.

I think that Trump has brought a lot of it on himself. It's in his DNA to be combative. It serves him well in business and entertainment, but not so much in politics. His supporters find it endearing. The left is annoyed, because all through the Clinton and Obama Presidencies, the RWM nitpicked every little thing they did. They were un-presidential and didn't respect the dignity of the office. Then... Trump - the least Presidential president ever was given a free pass by the RWM, because he was a DC outsider and was going to "drain the swamp". America has not been at its best the past 4 years and both sides are to blame. Nobody has the moral high ground.

This has been quite civil

MACA

The "this is how I am, take it or leave it" attitude is the exact reason why I have grown to like trump. Yeah some of the shit he says is ridiculous. But he means business, and gets it done

This is how discussions should be! Absent from all the name calling! All of us do it at some point or another when we have our "moments" of frustration.

I would say I did no name calling this evening/morning.

And same, watch the show! All of it! I’ll only then believe they you are open to research 😂

Possibly... But for America, I think we need to move on from it. We are fractured and we gain nothing by rehashing that. It only breeds resentment and makes it harder to find common ground. I know that Trump wanted to expand to Russia. I know that when he brought the Ms Universe Pageant to Russia that there is a reported conversation with one of the billionaire oligarchs that told him he could be president and offered assistance. Those are rumors that might best be left rumors, in my opinion. (Are those the things you are referring to?)

I will 100% watch it! Probably start it now.

Yes, we should move on from it. But we should take all the learnings we can get from it though

I agree... half our country is going to be really upset in the next 30 days unless we figure out how to bridge the divide and move forward.