Message from @Obungus

Discord ID: 522439211618402334


2018-12-12 15:37:34 UTC  

And again based on reason and science atheists can have morals

2018-12-12 15:38:32 UTC  

You can have a standard that doesn't change

2018-12-12 15:39:03 UTC  

but unless that thing undoubtedly defines good and evil it can not possibly be seen as an objective moral standard

2018-12-12 15:39:22 UTC  

God is an objective moral standard because He is unchanging and the definition of goodness

2018-12-12 15:39:50 UTC  

And where do God's morals come from

2018-12-12 15:40:05 UTC  

His natural attributes

2018-12-12 15:40:10 UTC  

Because he commands it?

2018-12-12 15:40:15 UTC  

no because He is it

2018-12-12 15:40:43 UTC  

His nature is what is good and seeing as God is immutable this means His morality is objective

2018-12-12 15:41:12 UTC  

And you have to listen to It

2018-12-12 15:41:42 UTC  

You don't *have* to

2018-12-12 15:41:51 UTC  

He gives you the option to ignore Him

2018-12-12 15:43:04 UTC  

So what happens if you ignore him

2018-12-12 15:43:14 UTC  

You get punished

2018-12-12 15:44:18 UTC  

Indeed

2018-12-12 15:44:34 UTC  

So you have to follow or else you'll get punished

2018-12-12 15:44:48 UTC  

That makes his moral's arbitrary

2018-12-12 15:45:29 UTC  

Because they're arbitrary it would mean God's morals are subjective

2018-12-12 15:46:33 UTC  

That isn't true at all

2018-12-12 15:46:44 UTC  

How so?

2018-12-12 15:46:54 UTC  

Just because there is a punishment for evil does not mean that good and evil don;t exist

2018-12-12 15:47:19 UTC  

I'm not saying good and evil do not exist

2018-12-12 15:47:57 UTC  

I'm saying that based off your logic god's morals would be subjective

2018-12-12 15:48:59 UTC  

And I am saying you are wrong because your argument doesn't make sense

2018-12-12 15:49:16 UTC  

How does it not make sense?

2018-12-12 15:49:20 UTC  

Morality is not a decision made by God it is based on how His nature

2018-12-12 15:49:40 UTC  

so it can not be arbitrary because it is His natural attributes that morality is based on

2018-12-12 15:58:39 UTC  

According to what religion

2018-12-12 15:58:45 UTC  

Christianity

2018-12-12 16:13:18 UTC  

So you mean that you get your morals from the Bible

2018-12-12 16:13:52 UTC  

We get our morals from God and that morality is communicated through the bible

2018-12-12 16:14:00 UTC  

the morality exists with or without the bible

2018-12-12 16:14:39 UTC  

But in general you get them from the Bible

2018-12-12 16:14:58 UTC  

no

2018-12-12 16:15:03 UTC  

We get them from God

2018-12-12 16:15:16 UTC  

who communicated them through the bible

2018-12-12 16:16:03 UTC  

You read it in the Bible and assume it is true so you get them from the Bible

2018-12-12 16:16:49 UTC  

I don't assume it is

2018-12-12 16:17:01 UTC  

I have a lot of reasons to believe it is

2018-12-12 16:17:24 UTC  

The Bible is subjective because the morals communicated through the Bible change constantly and contradict in the Bible

2018-12-12 16:17:53 UTC  

For example the "thou shalt not kill"