Workers

Better Workers

Without workers

better workers, the point of schools is to educate kids not brainwash them

No point in loyalty

i think there are problems with both approaches

if i had to pick one i'd say better workers

Loyal

I'll take the other side on this one

better workers obviously

The problem with the question is that you assume loyalty cannot be taught while also teaching how to be better workers

In fact, it usually comes hand in hand

The most disciplined and skilled children are also usually the most loyal.

For example, the Hitler Youth.

😬

Well, there's no denying the Hitler Youth were skilled as well as loyal.

No matter how messed up the whole thing was

workers, no matter how loyal they are, no country lasts forever, but contrributions do

I personally don't think you can have better workers without loyalty. You can teach them..sure..but what will end up happening is they're not encouraged enough to help the state with such skill.

are the hitler youth something the education system should aspire towards producing?

workers, as in people conditioned to be employees? or workers as in people with skills to do desired work?

Focus on neither?

Focus on providing a balanced education in all areas

rather than making drones

yeah

My impression is that we are currently suffering from this continual pattern of trying to turn students in to factory workers for factories that no longer exist

I'm not feeling this framing from the get-go, your really looking for your educational system to produce good citizens. That is people who can be part of society and bear the responsibilities that go along with that.

So you need to develop skills so they can be productive, and certainly school should lay the groundwork for that

You also need knowledge of how society is structured, so that needs to be taught.

i think the question is how you define better workers

if it's just more skilled workers then sure the schools should go for that

I will disagree with everyone based on the Aristotelian argument that a society is ultimately grounded in shared virtue and that virtue is the root of excellence, so that it's essential for the future citizens of a society to be taught moral values, such as being taught loyalty towards one's friends and neighbors.

but if a better worker is one who keeps their head down and works instead of questioning the system, that's not something the school should go for

I mean

whose morals?

morality is too vague of a term

A society requires that people have basic agreement on the ultimate goods and bads, otherwise they cannot create laws which are universally acceptable. So, the society's morals. It is only because some moral rules are unquestionably accepted that many others can be left up in the air.

which society?

and at what point in time?

Are these morals going to be stagnant, or are they going to develop over time?

Morals are relatively fluid and subjective