They basically tried changing the definition of "socialism" to prevent controversy, though they state socialism is their end goal

It's a lot of mental gymnastics, but that's the short of it

Social Democrats generally tend to believe in private property and rely on taxes (whether they be from businesses or the workers) to find their programs and efforts, and don't have socialism as the end goal, unless they're crypto-socialists

@SilverLining You're a lefty, how right am I here?

i like bernie sanders

Well, I hope you don't think he's a socialist, because you're wrong if you do

Bernie thinks state intervention and welfare are "socialist policies"

He's a retard

i think it's strategic if false

Well, he may be hiding his power level, but he's succeeding in reinforcing the false lolbert/boomer belief that socialism is just state intervention and welfare

that's true

Wouldnt it be fair to call them socailist policies? or would that require something simply more extreme?

that would require the state to seize the means of production

True, however we can discern between simply incorporating socialism full stop, and incorporating policy that has some ideas or foundations from socialism.

I would say that because you do welfare you are coming for the means of production because thats absurd

wut

@Bogatyr Bogumir That's not socialism.

Socialism implies social ownership and seizing the means of production

If libertarianism is the creationist version of economics, socialism is flat earth version of economics

surely however there are certain ideals socialists appeal to beyond simply seizing the means of production. Ill go and read up on it

lol

that is an amazing analogy

Well, a lot of people are misinformed as to what socialism is, because of people like Bernie Sanders

itll be easier for me to simply read up and understand directly what falls under socialism, because I may have just been living under a rock when it comes to economics my whole life

It's not even a "b- but it's not true socialism" scenario, he doesn't have the same end goals as a socialist, and if he does, he's not public about them

Also wasnt bernie part of a communist club or legitimately socialist club at one point, I remember that being a thing.

in his youth of course

when I say "true socialist", I mean those times when socialism gets implemented and they shout "but but but it wasn;t REAL socialism"

when it fails

that was a long time ago does it matter

It probably is true, he praised Castro is, the 80s? I think

But it was a long time ago

real socialism = successful socialism lol

Which doesn't exist

that's why it was never real socialism

They're technically correct when they say that it never was

Because socialism never was and never will be

exactly

It's a fantasy

So much like communism its only an intellectual unicorn fantasy

Socialism is always redefined when they realize it doesn't work

Like how Dengists claim socialism is "eliminating poverty"