Message from @UOC
Discord ID: 343096734991384578
to work okay, you can sub in Darwin maybe
I appreciate the procession from biology but
that also removes your ability to raise this one aspect
and also, it reduces to utilitarianism
because your argument is ultimately "this works"
no framework for what working ultimately is, or what is good or bad
ignoring the ultimate metaphysics
hence always prey to the bigger scope of leftism
I think there's another question here as well
why do you, or anyone else, feel a draw to secular right etc. at all?
No, and I note in the post that you would need to develop that framework a lot a lot. I was just interested in whether there was a workable basis
why is it good that things works out, rather than they be changed
even at a cost
for some moral good
I don't, my only interest in a secular right is in shifting a large block of US voters
I now think there is no workable basis, ultimately
but temporarily?
I think you could do it, I would consider it evil however
I wish there was a workable framework, it would make things much easier
Eh. Everyone is religious. Some people just have a certain misinterpretation of what religion is and call themselves atheists and oppose themselves to random doctrine
A secular rightism that appeals to them on those terms but causes them to follow the action of a fundamentally religious ideology
could eventually correct their adolescent reaction to "religion" haha
idk
just a thought experiment
yeah, I understand dont worry about it
happy to engage
I've had the same thought
about reaction -> religion
there's a couple of really big problems with that though
number 1 is just being able to accept it
after that there is the issue that if someone is misled into thinking that ultimately there can be a secular "reaction", they will be further from religion than if they had simply experienced the hypocritical degeneration of PC morality
and more: it leads to an inhuman style of thinking
which I feel ultimately deadens one to reception of such stuff
in a way honest leftism does not
2 is a good point
for the last point, Nietzsche is the best example
ultimately a tragic figure
the concern I have with that perspective is first that these slides happen on such a bigger-than-human timeframe it's hard for some people to connect the dots. They don't necessarily even see that they have problems, much less that their neurotic leftist moralising is causing those problems
and second that the advance of technology is a crutch that props up bad government
and makes it hard to point out the flaws because people revert to "well look at how far we've advanced"
you're quite right