well, exactly as I said. Let us say this Sect X of muslims had religious leaders that strongly discourage the reading of the hadeeth, yet believe the whole document to be authentic, and therefore the religious adherents feel like it's some kind of sin or apostasy to even open the hadeeth

But the hadeeth would tell you how you'd go about doing that.

Without hadeeth, and tradition, you wouldn't know how to pray.

these people don't know how at all

in fact almost none of the adherents at this point even know the hadeeth exists

That's an unprecedented situation.

There isn't a hadeeth document. There are compilations.

let's say that occurred to the letter. what would you think?

Various compilations exist

What would I think of who? The leaders?

They would be apostates.

The followers, depending on how much they know and their intentions.

so the leaders would be apostates

Either their leaders would shoulder the blame and they excused, or they would be apostates as well.

The leaders definitely would be.

what would distinguish the one from the other

One being genuinely misled.

but let us say they know of the existence of the hadeeth also, and also believe that it is a genuine document - in fact, they publicly affirm that very fact twice a year in a big meeting.

But don't follow it?

yes

and kick out anyone who does, and call them apostates

and become suspicious of anyone who so much admits to owning any hadeeth compilations

Not following some hadeeth would make you an apostate, not following some hadeeth would just make you a sinner, not following some hadeeth isn't ideal but you wouldn't have sinned not following it.

But rejecting it wholesale, while thinking it should be followed, would be apostasy.

They would be apostates in your scenario.

from where I am sitting, they would be horrible followers of the prophet if they believed they had a huge body of work directly from the people who followed the prophet in person, yet did not diligently read it and try to abide by it

They wouldn't be followers at all, if they're not actually following him.

that's right

They'd just be placating their communities

And be worse than non believers perhaps

that does seem reasonable, doesn't it?

Perfectly.

so the whole hypothetical was not about your religion, but mine

I am having some trouble and not quite sure what to do

Christianity is just social glue for a lot of people now.

I am not a christian, I am a mormon

What happened?

we believe in two specific prophets, who gave us a specific book we take as holy scripture. Mainstream mormons listen very intently to this book and to the modern leaders of the church. However, approximately 9,500 pages of modern and carefully documented sermons by the early leaders of our religion exist, however nobody follows them, nobody talks about them, but everyone knows they exist. They are a big giant taboo. I am starting to be called an apostate for directly reading the compiled words of our own prophets.

Why do they discount the sermons?

they don't know. If you ask them they can't tell you. However, they sneeringly refer to them as "non canonical, apocrypha"

"early leaders" are they prophets?