Well Obama pretty much gimped his signature bill by not challenging Joe Lieberman, whom was clearly in the pocket of big Pharma

Kiling public option is what turned obamacare into a shitshow, for the most part

and I mean when they foguht obama on other issues, he just said 'fuck you' and did like 8-10 executive orders

(not saying obamacare was a good idea, but obama caving on that is what brings us to our current situation where medicare-for-all is one of the most important electoral issues, at least for dems)

```But Lieberman – a professed liberal who supports access to abortion, gun control and some gay rights – infuriated former allies and Democratic voters in his own state with support for George Bush's war in Iraq, and astonished them by campaigning for John McCain and Palin in last year's presidential election.

Now, in the view of some, he is plumbing new depths of betrayal by using his deciding vote as an independent member of the Senate to hold hostage Barack Obama's reform of America's dysfunctional healthcare system.```

That's how you sell out, go big or go home

you're forgetting the many years inbetween

Obama left healthcare to the legislature

well that's same thing Trump and his people can say about everything too right?

"don't blame me, blame congress"

Obamacare is garbage tbh

Theres a town in Kenya called Ubunga

Well yea it was edited by the insurance industry and big pharma, lieberman's wife worked for them, was a consultant for them ,etc

The whole point of Obamacare was the public option, without it, it was pointless

And it cancelled a ton of people's private plans

it did, but that was the point of the public option, it was a 'lite' former of what people want with medicare for all

i would prefer reform in the other, more market oriented direction, but they have their influence to make sure the regulation works against that too

Like we see when the FDA helps big pharma crush small companies

Yeah I agree

Government is part of the reason why healthcare is so expensive

sort of, but i think stating it that way really misses the true essence, the previous 'big businesses' of the industry gave us the FDA and similar to begin with

and the AMA is the most powerful union in the country

ALLAH IS THE ONLY GOVERNMENT

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Wrong emojies

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no, it didn't cancel people's real private plans

government is absolutely not a reason healthcare is so expensive.

The wording is clumsy, but I get what people mean when they say it that way

I think libertarian types(like myself) do a bad PR job when we say it that way

it's just not true

Well what do you think about the FDA and the issue there of regulatory capture?

regulatory capture is a libertarian's dream

is it? I thought it was something libertarians are against

The U.S. health care cost crisis didn’t start until 1965. The government increased demand with the passage of Medicare and Medicaid while also restricting the supply of doctors and hospitals.

all the evils of regulatory capture would happen a thousandfold if those agencies did not exist

quite simply, no

1965 is when the generation that fought WWII started getting old