Okay. I'll ping you when I'm able to come on.

@fuck12moredeadcops I have an argument, but it seems so obvious I wouldn't think I'd need to give it.

@pennypal You can't "murder" in self defence.

Whatever you know what I meant

Murder is the killing of an innocent person, if the person is trying to kill you, they are not innocent.

Stop

We all get it

Ok buddy, I'll let you belive whatever you want even if it's incorrect.

@fuck12moredeadcops To answer your question, the advancement of society is wanted by a majority of people simply because it advanced their life as well, I.E., longer life expectancy, better food, better equipment.

There are many other examples but I'm sure you get it.

Why is the continuation of life and the progression of society more desire able than the alternative?

Dj... But it's not at all obvious what constitutes well being beyond simple ideas

And we know this because we have differences of opinion on abortion and the death penalty etc.

If it was obvious wed all agree

It’s wholly subjective to assert these things as more desirable to their alternatives

@fuck12moredeadcops Is your question "why do people not want to die early, live harder lives, and die from the common cold?"

Of course, there are people who desire to live in the "olden days" that's why it's not objectively desirable.

No, my question is “Why are any of these objectively morally superior to their alternatives?”

But if its objective it has to be by majority rules

It's not objective, I never argued that.

I mean subjective

No, @pennypal murder being bad isn't inheritely bad, but a majority thinks it is.

Subjective= majority rules

No, your getting this mixed up.

Exactly

That doesn't mean killing someone is objectively wrong.

It's not

For example, people who are pro euthanasia

Belive its morally correct TO kill that person, but others don't.

So just throw people in jail... Because we want to.

That makes no sence to what I just said.

If morality is subjective and it changes based on the time and culture you're in... There's no valid way to say the person has actually done wrong.

Of course, but it's the laws of that time that decide it, and laws can change.

In America, in this day, it's "wrong" to go and murder 500 innocent people.

Well that's fine but we can't label them as good or bad that we need to acknowledge do we really have no idea and we're putting him in jail because we want to

Some things are labeled as "bad" by the current day and age.

Actions have consequences

Right. So then slavery was correct for it today

Its day

@pennypal Yes, people used god and other means to jusitfy it.

God said it's okay to have slaves