^^^^^^

@dogbref way to articulate.

Dang @Yussuki ₪ interesting!

You're welcome! Yes, I think so.

Dang @Zurich04 you have some dang good thoughts and articulation.

He's in HIGH SCHOOL! So impressive! 🧐

I agree with JP here that faith is a prerequisite to truth, in that "believing" comes before understanding.

I also think that "religion has never, in any discovery of invention of a yarn, been the right answer" is way too strong.

You can look at it from two points -
1. Maybe its not the perfect system, but does something better exist that can also practically be applied (its worth the trade)? It doesn't seem so.
2. To use the word 'never' simply seems too strong. Rarely in debates, regardless of the topic, does 'never' and/or 'always' hold 100% true. It's just too much of a stretch. Especially when you already believe in world where absolute truth doesn't exist, then why would the word 'never' or 'always' be used in the first place?

Very interesting. It's quite enjoyable to read and discuss these topics with people who are willing to concede their argument from time to time and learn the others. 😂

I will point out something that's interesting that StoneCold spurred my thought towards -

A few things, actually...

1) I'm a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (or you may know this faith as 'Mormon').

Something I find interesting, and perhaps this is the 2nd *type of faith* you were alluding to, StoneCold. There are many people in my faith (and in many faiths, and in fact, outside of organized faiths, too) that proclaim or at least communicate their faith *as if it is a wish.*

For example, "I believe in Jesus Christ. I believe He is my savior."

The words themselves are quite interesting....it's almost as if you could replace "Jesus Christ" with "Santa Clause".

On the other hand, there's something interesting about it, too...

Despite how *absolutely odd and perhaps naive*this statement is, it still somehow provides people with some form of optimism. And that's good. At least it does that! Although there is a problem as to whether people are telling the truth or not....

And that might be a *bigger problem?*

^ StoneCold, I agree with your thoughts on Prayer, but it's also difficult to reconcile them with my own faith. 😓

2) There is a Catholic Bishop, Robert Bishop Barron, who is very philosophically oriented...I feel he does a great job in this video discussing some ideas to reconcile some things between 'reason' and 'faith'. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GcH_5Iecu5s

He has a few others where the ideas of subjective and objective truth are discussed.....a little too complicated at this time for me to articulate, but I think it was based around the idea that *there is no objective way of proving that objectivity is the best way of finding truth* 🤣

Wow, interesting, Zino.

Lol

I feel like what I'm reading is perhaps a misunderstanding in terms of perspective from Zino and JP?

I haven't seen the context of this discussion, but just going off of @Malachi s post here. This is interesting and I have a few thoughts on this:

Taxes are crucial and vital in order for a society to develop. I have a friend who essentially lies about much of his taxes. It's a shame. I would argue he is taking advantage of society (in that he continues to use the goods and services society offers him, like public roads, for example, without paying for it in anyway). In the big picture, it seems to just be a short-term and selfish approach.

At the same time, I am a small business owner. There are some taxes that I consider absolutely proposterous....namely one that requires tax payments on all assets in an office/owned by the business from year to year. I can't remember the name of it..

I lived in Ghana for a bit, and also lived in India for a year and a half. One thing I learned is that the 'financial system' (if that is the proper way to term it) can easily be undermined. For example, if you are pulled over by a cop, you can easily pay them off so that you don't receive a ticket. Does this help you? Sure. Does this help enforce necessary laws of society? Absolutely not. It causes more harm than benefit. I also wondered while in these countries if one of the reasons they struggle to develop as aggressively as others is because people can get away without paying taxes as much (there is less of a structure to enforce so, like there is in the USA for example). I wonder on this? Any thoughts?

Last, @Malachi, I wouldn't lay undermining/avoiding taxes at 'rightists' feet, although I could definitely see it happening more there. I would imagine people on both ends of the political spectrum do this often on a personal basis (although I could be wrong).

First paragraph @Malachi Yeah, makes sense.

What do you mean by my lobby in America is broken? Like the small business representation in American politics is underrepresented, or something like that?

Interesting. Quite frankly, I don't follow politics enough to know that, but enjoy talking political philosophy.

I've found it hard to engage in politics because things always seem so one-sided.

Sin in Hebrew means to "miss the target." To keep it simple, you might call that target God (as the Israelites and Jews did). In essence, when you sin, you are distancing or separating yourself from God. You are going onto a different path that leads away from (or misses) God.

In contrast, consider the word *repentance*. To repent, in Greek, means literally to *turn around*. To repent is to veer back on the path towards and 'stop missing' the target (God).

It seems to me that other ways of defining sin just seem to complicated. Also, when you try to bring in single and particular situations and appropriate them with the question "is this a sin"? or "Is that a sin?" it doesn't seem to answer the important question, really. Honestly, if you've read the New Testament, it sounds a little....Sadducee like?....on the surface.

Again, sin means to "miss the target" where the target is God. What and who your God is, and what that are both great questions, but they are separate questions. Of course, to have a shared meaning around the word sin in light of the vast variety of beliefs and thoughts that exist is complex... If everyone's definition of sin is as above ^, and everyone 'believes' in their own God, then everyone's realization of sin could be different, and therefore it's relative.

Interesting... Yet, as Nietzche and JP say, beliefs are not what you say, your beliefs are what you do.

Food for thought...

@StoneCold316 I like your definition.