for instance, before stalin life expectancy was around ~37 or so

it became like 60 something by the end of the reign

which meant that more children were being born (becaues medicine) and people were living longer

which counteracted some of the pop loss from ww2 and famines

but not nearly enough to facilitate +80 Million people in 20 years, thats just absurd

+40 Million at the absolute most is the most believable

Estimates I've seen is about 1-2 million, but thats just because the Soviet Union is pretty damn big place.

besides, there a lot of kulaks to get rid of

honnestly, the kulaks deserved it, but I don't like the fact that Stalin sent anarchists to the gulags too

besides that act of Left Secretarianism, Stalin was a pretty cool noodle

nonetheless, still sent to prisons.

and its kinda hard to justify prisons

(except for kulaks of course)

this is a new one

never heard about this

But wasn't Lenin a-okay with the Anarchists?

It was mainly Trotsky and Stalin that didn't like Anarchists

just gave it a bit of a read

it doesn't mention her being an anarchist here

but for the sake of arguement, lets say she is

it still wasn't Anarchism in general that attacked Lenin, or even a group, just one Radical

Obviously he didn’t AGREE with anarchism, I was just saying that Lenin could with with them while Trot and Stalin couldn’t

Also my computer just had a heart attack, I’m using my phone

And if she alone made Lenin sick and useless, then how did Lenin last four years after this, AND effectively lead the Soviet Union?

Because the assassination was in 1918, right in the middle of the civil war

But either way, I understand your point

Besides, bickering over whether it was anarchists or communists that started all the violence is rubbish

It’s what the capitalist class would want us to do

But thanks for the history, Comrade.

You too.

In my opinion, Communism is only as effective as the guy in charge. You get somebody like Lenin, Stalin, or Mao in power things are pretty cool. Get a cuck like Gorbachev and everything sucks and we have capitalism again

I agree @Deleted User that they had some pretty bad authoritarianism, as an Anarchist I see that as pretty bad. But I think their achievenments were pretty cool, not necessarily themselves.

also @Shwiani, Stalin mainly killed Kulaks (which is good) and some anarchists (which is bad),but most humans in history? far from it. The statistic that says "Communism Killed 100 Million people" is an exaggeration from the Black Book of Communism, which concluded it was 94 million. The source itself was exaggerated too. In fact, the publishers of the Black Book of Communism went back and said that they greatly exagerrated their sources to drive up the numbers! For instance, they considered anybody arrested to be "a death under communism". Furthermore, the population of Russia actually INCREASED during stalin's reign from 1922-1952, from 120 million to 140 million. If 20 million were supposedly "killed under communism", then wouldn't that population increase in fact be a DECREASE? And on the topic of famines, the industrialization policies under Stalin and Mao actually ENDED famines in their respective countries-- famines which plagued the nations for hundreds of years.

So to say that "they killed the most humans in history" is a capitalist lie

Now do I agree with Stalin and Mao?

No, I think industrialization and re-militarization of thier nations could esaily be achieved under Anarchism, without resorting to Totalitarianism.

But that doesn't mean I should whine and say they were big meanies that killed a hundred quadrillion people

eh, i dont mind that stalin gulaged the filthy grain horders

and the nazis deserved what they got in ww2

everything else however, stalin wasn't justified in doing

I think that holodomor was a combination of bad weather conditions and bueacratic incompetency.

For instance, the soviet regime sold a lot of their grain mostly to buy machine parts for industrialization, which eventually got the food situation under control but for the time being only increased the levels of starvation.

I also don't think it could've been a genocide, because it mostly effected peasants. There is no way in hell that I could believe that Joseph Stalin would lead a genocide to KILL PEASANTS.

The entire communist ideology is based around PROTECTING the peasants, and Stalin was and alwasy has been a die-hard communist

hell, he read up on communism very extently in his university days

and in an interview one of his bodygaurds said that he went out of his way to give people waiting for their late bus one day rides to their location

he drove them himself

that too

so I don't agree with the very liberal view of history that says "Stalin was a big meanie that just wanted power and corrupted the soviet union with genocides and bad stuff"

sure he had some imperialistic aspects to him, and he had some questionable choices at times

but he's still my comreade

thanks bro

direct rule from london

cant use caps apparently

thats because half your sentence was lowercase, the entirety of my sentence was uppercase

so "direct rule FROM LONDON" works

but not "DIRECT RULE FROM LONDON" I'm afraid

feelsbadman

so what are you @Deleted User? Anarchist? Libertarian Socialist?

ah

of course

big difference between George Orwell and Berni Sanders

Luxembourgism huh? not bad

too bad she got killed by Bernie Sanders smh

social democrats killed rosa luxembourg

then again, not a huge difference between the two

yeah, Stalin is a pretty contraversial guy

I still accept him as my comrade for the sake of left unity, but I disagree with his uneseccary killing

lmao @Shwiani the only thing we've done so far on that is "Famines happen all the time!"

other than that, this isn't a tankie thread

Nothing says anti-imperialism like invading finland for littearlly no reason

but hey, besides that the soviet union was pretty lit

oh yeah, the imprisoning of anarchist comrades wasn't good either

but hey, you win some you loose some

I agree @Krieg#0336

All of socialism was

Yeah, some right wing memers have assaulted the front lines and have since made conquest to the once lefty pol server, but the worker never rests, and shall seize this lost territory

*Citation Needed

also, i work, so lel

.....yes, I am.

i work... as a worker... therfore, I'm a worker.

k

hell nah

this is a lefty server

bats?

thats some weak shit

if you ain't throwing molotov cocktails at police cars I ain't talking to you 😤

nice

itsa good piece of art my dude

i put it on an anarchist flag

its a good profile pic

It’s a hearts of iron 4 mod

Where Germany won ww1

And Britain became syndicalist along with France (and America if you let it)

@kriegsmariner VA so how would the economy function under Strasserism?

bro this debate is kinda interesting, i should grab popcorn.

oof

To be fair though, race superiority is pretty integral to Nazism and such, kindof hard to expect them to "not bring it into politics" when it's the core of their ideals. I agree that race superiority is stupid and overall misguided, but we shouldn't shoot it down from the conversation comepletely, even if it's wrong. It's still worth a good laugh.

Nazism is shorthand for National Socialism

at least, thats what I've alwasy thought it was