#general (Discord ID: 267086373285134338) in Realism, page 462


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2017-05-22 21:17:19 UTC

purpose itself is the metaphysical enemy of freedom

2017-05-22 21:17:37 UTC

Imagine a God having a "purpose"

2017-05-22 21:17:52 UTC

It would completely obliterade his sense of unconditionality

2017-05-22 21:17:58 UTC

It is more freeing to people to take choice away from them - bad choices, useless choices, choices they don't want.

2017-05-22 21:17:59 UTC

Which is the basis for freedom

2017-05-22 21:18:32 UTC

It is the highest achievement to realize the futility of choices

2017-05-22 21:18:56 UTC

Think how people of all craft in the end limit their choices

2017-05-22 21:19:27 UTC

I do. We're agreeing. I'm just making the policy argument because I don't trust people to come to the realization on their own

2017-05-22 21:19:37 UTC

The Meaning of Freedom is heavely conflated, we have freedom in the sense that you talk about it namely spiritual freedom in other words being more free from ones animalic nature/subconscious or having acquired the skill to realise and eleminate ones biases from ones thinking and thereby achieving a "higher" sense of consciousness.

2017-05-22 21:19:59 UTC

The danger is in people's realizations being founded on fleeting sensations

2017-05-22 21:20:19 UTC

Which is always the truth the less there exists some sort of metaphysical order

2017-05-22 21:20:49 UTC

@MK realization of ones spiritual unconditionality is the only meaningful freedom

2017-05-22 21:21:18 UTC

put squarely, one can for example become unconditional by fully embracing the possibility of cessation of his physical existence at will

2017-05-22 21:21:24 UTC

Then There is the sense of political freedom, having certain rights in other words the souvereign promises to restrict his own behaviour in some sense, for example free speech the state promises not to stop you from speaking your mind within common spaces

2017-05-22 21:21:34 UTC

but again, refusing to ascribe to it the "ultimate meaning"

2017-05-22 21:21:55 UTC

you can parse the word freedom however you want. I'm only talking about it in the colloquial sense of choices available to an individual

2017-05-22 21:22:53 UTC

The leftist use freedom in the sense of being free from obligations/dutys while still getting the benefits

2017-05-22 21:23:07 UTC

Yeah

2017-05-22 21:23:11 UTC

i . e. Freedom from Duty

2017-05-22 21:23:32 UTC

but the rightists will argue that More Choices = More Freedom

2017-05-22 21:23:47 UTC

and that's what I'm objecting to

2017-05-22 21:24:03 UTC

One must not under any circumstance give choices any inherent value

2017-05-22 21:24:25 UTC

I've agreed with you this entire time @The Enlightened Shepherd

2017-05-22 21:24:51 UTC

Other than allowing choices where choice fulfills a desired function

2017-05-22 21:25:23 UTC

For example, pattern of making bad choices when given option, can be used to realize that an individual is a danger to himself and therefore to he group

2017-05-22 21:26:12 UTC

Every higher power wants to limit the choices of it's subordinates, this is the basic law

2017-05-22 21:26:48 UTC

The higher the power, the more choices and the greater the need for a "purpose" which will serve as a guiding light

2017-05-22 21:27:04 UTC

Since multiplicity of choices always brings existential crisis of a sort

2017-05-22 21:27:08 UTC

It's usually in peoples own interest. i limit my own choices because I am unhappy if I face endless meaningless choices

2017-05-22 21:27:46 UTC

Same here

2017-05-22 21:27:48 UTC

Freedom has naturally certain restrictions namely the physical ones obviously, but also other human beings have a natural genetically imprinted sense of justice, they realise when costs are externalized on them and will try to retaliate against you so those are natural limits to your behaviour too

2017-05-22 21:28:10 UTC

I deleted some dozen plugins because I could spend days trying to figure out which instrument to use when making music

2017-05-22 21:28:25 UTC

Limiting your options is a powerful strategy in modern times

2017-05-22 21:30:19 UTC

"but also other human beings have a natural genetically imprinted sense of justice" most peoples sense of justice is their greater capability to abstractly conceive things, which results in them using themselves as a reference

2017-05-22 21:30:30 UTC

these are the sort of people with whom you can have "good things"

2017-05-22 21:30:41 UTC

Absolutely. Some clinical research also supports the notion that limited choices and limited resources also result in greater creativity and problem solving ability.

2017-05-22 21:30:45 UTC

This does not apply to most

2017-05-22 21:31:46 UTC

Presentation of choice and presentation of information is a major issue in policy discussions too.

2017-05-22 21:33:04 UTC

Behind every choice in modern public dealings, lies some sort of tyrany

2017-05-22 21:33:05 UTC

The Good effect of limited choices can really be seen within art, if you restrict the tools and the styles that one can use one has it offers a kind of tool to compare and assess artpieces based on the characters one has defined within such a framework

2017-05-22 21:33:37 UTC

In modernity, choice itself is tyranny, becase bad choices prevail

2017-05-22 21:33:51 UTC

Limitation of choice is freedom

2017-05-22 21:33:59 UTC

and self-limitation the fullest freedom

2017-05-22 21:36:58 UTC

Self-limitation is utilitarianism

2017-05-22 21:37:08 UTC

Freedom is non-utilitarian, meaning, unconditional

2017-05-22 21:37:19 UTC

It's free from every purpose and direction

2017-05-22 21:37:28 UTC

This is of course, from purely philosophical point of view

2017-05-22 21:38:24 UTC

From point of view of practicality, self-limitation can yield superior results where abundance of choices creates a sense of a lack of direction

2017-05-22 22:04:04 UTC

This reminded me of James J. Frazer's book, the golden bough

2017-05-22 22:04:21 UTC

One of the most famous sources for "evolutionary" study of religion

2017-05-22 22:04:53 UTC

Which nevertheless, willingly or not, was quite of a source for getting genuinely interested in spiritual matters

2017-05-22 22:08:58 UTC

In exposing obviously, the central part that mortality plays in every kind of cult (though not making differentiations other than in the method of association) it's stunning how it didnt provide foundation to keep contemplating on the issue, but merely to remain confident in "rationality" which simply acknowledges death, but does not ponder

2017-05-22 22:09:03 UTC

Golden Bough is excellent. Good primer for lots of Joseph Campbell's work. Reading article now.

2017-05-22 22:09:56 UTC

What in science stands for "overcoming your insticts" in spiritual exploration can stand for the same kind of progress, but which does not lead towards conclusion that science suffices

2017-05-22 22:11:40 UTC

btw i read only short version of the book, the thing is gargantuan in volume

2017-05-22 22:12:44 UTC

I read it years ago. Agree that it served as diving board for some Jungian mythopoetic / spiritual pondering

2017-05-22 22:12:57 UTC

I was smoking a lot of weed at the time

2017-05-22 22:13:41 UTC

I am a genius

2017-05-22 22:13:51 UTC

I figured out how to do brahmin diet even with inferior quality whey protein

2017-05-22 22:14:02 UTC

first explain brahmin diet

2017-05-22 22:14:46 UTC

I'm not sure I'm allowed to

2017-05-22 22:15:07 UTC

in your case I am not certain I can't, but time will tell if I can

2017-05-22 22:16:31 UTC

cryptic

2017-05-22 22:18:12 UTC

LENTILS AND OKRA

2017-05-22 22:18:18 UTC

ONLY FLATULENCE IS DISADVANTAGE

2017-05-22 22:18:23 UTC

brahmin diet is NOT STEAK

2017-05-22 22:18:24 UTC

i like lentils

2017-05-22 22:18:29 UTC

I LIKE STEAK

2017-05-22 22:18:32 UTC

NOT BURG

2017-05-22 22:18:38 UTC

BUT BURRITOS ARE GOOD TOO

2017-05-22 22:18:41 UTC

GUACAMOLE

2017-05-22 22:18:44 UTC

CHEESE

2017-05-22 22:18:45 UTC

steak once a week is good

2017-05-22 22:18:46 UTC

It's okay. I'm not going to insist on an explanation

2017-05-22 22:18:48 UTC

JALAPENOS

2017-05-22 22:18:49 UTC

what about corned beef

2017-05-22 22:18:54 UTC

boooooooooo

2017-05-22 22:18:58 UTC

HISSSSSSSSSSSSSSS

2017-05-22 22:19:26 UTC

steak is dalit

2017-05-22 22:19:29 UTC

corned beef is intense dalit

2017-05-22 22:19:37 UTC

I'm all keto these days. Not much red meat though.

2017-05-22 22:19:42 UTC

whats dalit

2017-05-22 22:19:45 UTC

keto is a meme and not scientific

2017-05-22 22:20:00 UTC

has no advantage over caloric control and is worse long term because you can't keto diet forever

2017-05-22 22:20:22 UTC

also encourages eating shit food, they will get heart disease and die

2017-05-22 22:21:23 UTC

why cant we just eat preserved meat and tubers like normal folk

2017-05-22 22:21:40 UTC

Taubes et al would disagree. I'm not keto forever. I cycle reasonable carbs back in once in a while. But low carb doesn't disagree with me.

2017-05-22 22:21:52 UTC

whats keto

2017-05-22 22:22:00 UTC

Caloric control isn't my issue.

2017-05-22 22:22:03 UTC

Keto is the asian butler to green horneg

2017-05-22 22:22:05 UTC

Hornet

2017-05-22 22:22:14 UTC

preserved meat is dalit

2017-05-22 22:22:21 UTC

eat it if you want, but you will die

2017-05-22 22:22:26 UTC

meat is very simple

2017-05-22 22:22:36 UTC

a "ketogenic" diet is a diet that is low in carbohydrates to the extend that the body begins producing ketone bodies for energy instead of relying on glucose

2017-05-22 22:22:47 UTC

But what is dalit

2017-05-22 22:22:48 UTC

who are you explaining this to UOC

2017-05-22 22:22:55 UTC

Enlightened Shepherd

2017-05-22 22:23:09 UTC

is it basically paleo

2017-05-22 22:23:14 UTC

and why is it bad for the hearth

2017-05-22 22:23:19 UTC

paleo

2017-05-22 22:23:21 UTC

what

2017-05-22 22:23:32 UTC

isnt everything we eat paleo bc its all like plants

2017-05-22 22:23:42 UTC

and like fruits and like meats and cows n junk

2017-05-22 22:24:16 UTC

There is a lot of argument about it. Paleo and Keto do seem to overlap since I think both would reject a lot of modern food and grains. But I don't think paleo has the same problem keto has with sugar. They are two different philosophies that from a distance look similar

2017-05-22 22:24:38 UTC

But "keto" refers to a specific metabolic state that Paleo doesn't really consider

2017-05-22 22:24:55 UTC

what everyone needs for good hearth is basically fat acids no ?

2017-05-22 22:25:07 UTC

whih is basically dairy and fish

2017-05-22 22:25:32 UTC

paleo is bs

2017-05-22 22:25:38 UTC

as most of their calroies came from foraged food

2017-05-22 22:25:40 UTC

and not meat

2017-05-22 22:25:49 UTC

paleo is good guiding philosophy but should not be obeyed religiously

2017-05-22 22:25:59 UTC

That would be a keto-friendly position. They and other low carb dieters argue that the diet should be roughly 70% fat and as little carbs as possible, especially as little refined carbs and sugar as possible.

2017-05-22 22:26:03 UTC

humans are well adapted for eating grain

2017-05-22 22:26:07 UTC

it's about not being afat fuck

2017-05-22 22:26:08 UTC

and not eating

2017-05-22 22:26:11 UTC

crap

2017-05-22 22:26:23 UTC

i follow onision for tips on how to get a vegetarian body

2017-05-22 22:26:24 UTC

grains are simply a chore

2017-05-22 22:26:43 UTC

you eat a shitload of that and it's contribution is giving you the sensation of being full

2017-05-22 22:26:57 UTC

some are better than other though

2017-05-22 22:27:01 UTC

actually TES grains contain calories and you are retarded

2017-05-22 22:27:19 UTC

buckwheat for example

2017-05-22 22:27:24 UTC

no shit sherlock

2017-05-22 22:27:25 UTC

the argument made by more literate dietary science people is that carbs interrupt the hormonal cycles of insulin and other weight regulation hormones, driving obesity and some bad health.

2017-05-22 22:27:39 UTC

lol that's retarded

2017-05-22 22:27:52 UTC

why is japan entirely skinny with 3% obesity if carbs make you fat

2017-05-22 22:27:55 UTC

this is americanism

2017-05-22 22:27:55 UTC

since i have no horses in this race how bout them yankees

2017-05-22 22:28:29 UTC

better tell japan to stop eating rice to stop the obesity epidemic

2017-05-22 22:28:29 UTC

china too

2017-05-22 22:28:30 UTC

@Deleted User 57835c2c that's a good point that would need to be answered. But let me ask you this: why do men get bellies but women deposit fat on their hips and ass and tits?

2017-05-22 22:28:30 UTC

and india

2017-05-22 22:28:37 UTC

japanese eat from the plates he size of a palm and east mostly radioactive fish, some rice and some herbs

2017-05-22 22:28:52 UTC

so IOW the calories matter, not the carbs. got it

2017-05-22 22:28:53 UTC

americans eat from a back of a pickup truck

2017-05-22 22:29:05 UTC

Exilarch you are such a sherlock

2017-05-22 22:29:10 UTC

nk

2017-05-22 22:29:12 UTC

no

2017-05-22 22:29:21 UTC

wetbacks buy food from a truck to eat in a truck

2017-05-22 22:29:22 UTC

well if it's calories and not carbs hten what is the fucking point of low carb

2017-05-22 22:29:32 UTC

it's in the balance

2017-05-22 22:29:39 UTC

most people eat more carb than they need

2017-05-22 22:29:41 UTC

way more

2017-05-22 22:29:59 UTC

people in the past ate more of it becaus they needed to work in the field all day and couldn't affor eating cow meat every week

2017-05-22 22:30:20 UTC

so they ate food which contained lot of grains, dairy products, etc

2017-05-22 22:30:45 UTC

they grew fruits that bore a lot of fruit with high nutritive value like figs for example

2017-05-22 22:30:45 UTC

and stuff they can easily store

2017-05-22 22:30:47 UTC

cherries

2017-05-22 22:30:48 UTC

etc

2017-05-22 22:31:01 UTC

@Deleted User 57835c2c my argument is not that it's calories. My argument is that food intake, among other factors, drives the body's hormonal state, which can result in dietary problems. Saying that "people get fat because they eat more calories than they burn" is true but meaningless. It's like saying "this room got crowded because more people entered than left." Why did that happen?

2017-05-22 22:31:23 UTC

modern lifestyle, which includes so many hours of sitting in the chair

2017-05-22 22:31:28 UTC

can benefit fromvery low carb diet

2017-05-22 22:31:30 UTC

YOUR BODY DIGESTS EASILY BROKEN DOWN STUFF FIRST

2017-05-22 22:31:40 UTC

IF YOU EAT A WHOLE BUNCH OF SUGAR, THE BODY WILL TAKE THAT UP AND DISCARD THE GOOD STUFF

2017-05-22 22:31:46 UTC

even the hours when man does not sit in the chari today, contain very little activity

2017-05-22 22:31:57 UTC

wait... so calories are overeaten because of dietary composition, not because of failing to quantify calories/portions?

2017-05-22 22:32:01 UTC

how does that work?

2017-05-22 22:33:13 UTC

eating a bowl of strawberries, 2 slices of hard chees and having a glass of milk

2017-05-22 22:33:22 UTC

i brought a ham and cheese sandwich and fruit for lunch

2017-05-22 22:33:23 UTC

will gain you less fat than eating 3 sandwiches

2017-05-22 22:33:26 UTC

simple as that

2017-05-22 22:33:42 UTC

BOTH OVEREATING AND COMPOSITION OF WHAT IS EATEN MATTER, IN MY VIEW

2017-05-22 22:33:48 UTC

PEOPLE EAT TOO MUCH. THAT IS NOT THE NEWS.

2017-05-22 22:33:51 UTC

THEY ALSO EAT THE WRONG STUFF.

2017-05-22 22:33:56 UTC

too much bread usually is unnecessary

2017-05-22 22:34:00 UTC

prozak I hear you are fat IRL and eat burritos and cheap beer

2017-05-22 22:34:01 UTC

CARBS ARE KIND OF A BEAST BECAUSE SO MANY ARE REFINED WHEAT

2017-05-22 22:34:03 UTC

EXACTLY

2017-05-22 22:34:06 UTC

obesity used to be a sign of privlege but now its a sign of poorness

2017-05-22 22:34:09 UTC

for modern needs, a slice of bread per meal max

2017-05-22 22:34:11 UTC

BURRITOS AND CHEAP BEER, SOUNDS DELICIOUS!

2017-05-22 22:35:10 UTC

@Deleted User 57835c2c when you begin to digest carbohydrates your body produces various hormones to effect certain processes like 1) removing sugar from the blood 2) storing excess energy in fat cells 3) telling the brain you are full etc. Those hormonal states can be either optimal for leanness, or not optimal for leanness. Part of that depends on what you eat. There are other factors like trauma depression etc. I can recommend you a book on the subject if you're interested or i can link you research papers but that will take me some time since I'm at work haha.

2017-05-22 22:35:34 UTC

high carb diet is an agrarian diet

2017-05-22 22:35:35 UTC

I'm not arguing that fatties aren't responsible for being fat. It's just a little more complicated

2017-05-22 22:35:47 UTC

a diet where you eat one meal and work for hours in the field

2017-05-22 22:35:55 UTC

dr exilarch

2017-05-22 22:36:07 UTC

phd in kek

2017-05-22 22:36:21 UTC

Okay well as a medical doctor, you know better than I do that field specialization means you don't have to know anything about human nutrition lol

2017-05-22 22:36:56 UTC

I don't have to, but I elect to

2017-05-22 22:37:10 UTC

studies showing calories matter for weight change more than macros stack up like a mountain

2017-05-22 22:37:18 UTC

p.e taught us the food pyramid

2017-05-22 22:37:20 UTC

what natty vs non natty BBers do is also studied

2017-05-22 22:38:58 UTC

my understanding is that calorie restrictive diets are well known to fail at regulating obesity over the mid- and long-terms

2017-05-22 22:39:00 UTC

autistic dietary theories incorporated

2017-05-22 22:39:13 UTC

diet = feeding your body what it needs

2017-05-22 22:39:20 UTC

duh

2017-05-22 22:39:40 UTC

but I haven't argued that calories don't matter. My point is just that the thermodynamic view of calories is meaningless

2017-05-22 22:39:46 UTC

because it doesn't explain anything

2017-05-22 22:39:48 UTC

good diet = avoiding excessive intake, malnutrition and intake of toxic components

2017-05-22 22:40:51 UTC

but how many of u guys actually eat really healthily

2017-05-22 22:41:29 UTC

Is any of this actually in practice

2017-05-22 22:41:35 UTC

practical diet = a diet that is accustomed to your local supply, purchasing power, immediate needs and lifestyle

2017-05-22 22:43:01 UTC

calorie restrictive diets fail in the medium and long term but not for no reason

2017-05-22 22:43:06 UTC

it's because normal fucking retards cannot do it

2017-05-22 22:43:23 UTC

it's because whatever percent of fatties cannot stick to it deserve to be fat

2017-05-22 22:43:51 UTC

there is another reason also but I decline to express it

2017-05-22 22:44:58 UTC

did yarfy tell you that

2017-05-22 22:46:42 UTC

no

2017-05-22 22:47:03 UTC

it's something I figured out myself and it was hard won knowledge and I'll only give it to the most good and respectful people

2017-05-22 22:47:12 UTC

secondly yarfy and I are no longer associated, I study the vedas independently now

2017-05-22 22:49:06 UTC

i think that to some people hunger appears in a diabolical fashion

2017-05-22 22:49:22 UTC

it happened to me that i stay up late many times and feel intense hunger

2017-05-22 22:49:30 UTC

but i always drinka glass of water andgo to bed

2017-05-22 22:49:32 UTC

that's because you are a fat dalit

2017-05-22 22:49:39 UTC

i never ever opened fridge and ate after dinner

2017-05-22 22:49:48 UTC

how many calories do you eat fat boy

2017-05-22 22:50:03 UTC

im 72 kg on 179 height btw

2017-05-22 22:50:18 UTC

skinnyfat

2017-05-22 22:50:21 UTC

if thatćs fat than the only nutritionaly correct place is auschwity

2017-05-22 22:50:27 UTC

yeah, imaginefat

2017-05-22 22:50:35 UTC

im skinny but i identify as fat lol

2017-05-22 22:50:46 UTC

yarfy is retarded and so are his advices which he passed on to you

2017-05-22 22:51:00 UTC

no, you are retarded

2017-05-22 22:51:09 UTC

no your parents are retarded

2017-05-22 22:51:11 UTC

you eat a diet of salted lard

2017-05-22 22:51:22 UTC

since they obviously gave brith to such an imbecile creation

2017-05-22 22:51:29 UTC

186cm / 81kg

2017-05-22 22:51:52 UTC

i eat a diet which does not produce mental retardations such as in your case

2017-05-22 22:52:14 UTC

yes you are a doctor and that is your achievement that you boast with

2017-05-22 22:52:16 UTC

varna boy

2017-05-22 22:52:28 UTC

as opposed to your achievement of...?

2017-05-22 22:52:39 UTC

do you have any idea how dumb you actually are

2017-05-22 22:53:06 UTC

do you think your profession leaves any kind of impression me at all

2017-05-22 22:53:08 UTC

Exilarch are you really a doctor? what specialty?

2017-05-22 22:53:11 UTC

My dad's a doctor

2017-05-22 22:53:13 UTC

is that what impresses your neighbors

2017-05-22 22:53:22 UTC

are they as dumb as you

2017-05-22 22:53:24 UTC

so you have no superior achievement

2017-05-22 22:53:30 UTC

compared to what

2017-05-22 22:53:31 UTC

yours

2017-05-22 22:53:35 UTC

consider that this is not my only achievement in life

2017-05-22 22:53:43 UTC

but what are your superior achievements?

2017-05-22 22:53:53 UTC

give me your best shot, other than succeeding in learing how to ead

2017-05-22 22:54:20 UTC

dont let them see you sweat

2017-05-22 22:54:22 UTC

take it easy

2017-05-22 22:55:17 UTC

a lot in terms of quantity or ?

2017-05-22 22:55:22 UTC

both

2017-05-22 22:55:29 UTC

because you are a sad, shallow person

2017-05-22 22:55:37 UTC

so what are your accomplishments again?

2017-05-22 22:55:39 UTC

chronically irritated, compulsive

2017-05-22 22:55:49 UTC

you run from a snetiment to sentiment

2017-05-22 22:55:55 UTC

what were your accomplishments again?

2017-05-22 22:56:01 UTC

you dont have any opiniions or convictions, you only resppond to irritations

2017-05-22 22:56:04 UTC

like an animal

2017-05-22 22:56:12 UTC

what were your accomplishments again?

2017-05-22 22:56:22 UTC

it apperas that the best way to condition you is a rolled up newspaper

2017-05-22 22:56:32 UTC

what were your accomplishments again?

2017-05-22 22:56:32 UTC

since apparently that is how you conform

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