will I get in trouble for killing comrades

@OF-8 why are you bringing up rules? I simply ask you not to, I don't demand it

I think so, but remember that there isn't a proletarian state yet

it's harder to put order in that

Don't you think it is safer for me if communists just try to democratically win

No revolution to fuck the country up

This is just not possible though

demsoc?

look Allende

reform won't happen

They're always invaded by imperialists and shot

I don't want my house invaded by bloodthirsty revolutionaries

one and the same

people need to be active and defend the country

if you're a worker

then it benefits you and you don't have to fear it

i want blowies

what if I am a business owner

i need blowies

then your material interest is against that of commies

from capitalism to socialism business owners are expropriated

these arguments always just go in circles and no one ever changes their viewpoint

but they could collaborate with you in feudalism

or if you're a poor owner

and you're in risk of proletarization

will I be sent to gulag

i hope

depends entirely on everything

yes it depends

How about no one is sent to gulag for not knowing what they were even doing wrong

youll get the rope one day

they were exploiting

watsss up

it's fair they pay for what they've stolen

mostly people who are actuively against the changes will have chance of gulag

@Deleted User <--- mentally ill

I need to poop

ye

no doubt

people could forgive you

there's no reason to gulag someone who is alright with the changes

everyones poops

so if I worked to build my business up

and I get pissed if it is confiscated

will I be sent to gulag?

that depends way too much to be answerable

poopers

it depends if you're a poor peasant

a little bourgeois

as I said, they could work with you

if you try and hire people to defend your property then probably

are your workeres given equal share in the business you onw ?

what if I am not poor

but upper middle class

yes

but if you made a big fortune exploiting, you could be judged like a criminal

business is family run

or do you treat them like dogs and take the fruits of their labor

@Sorghagtani Beki then it might not even get seized

what if I had 1 worker

who was outside my family

that's little bourgeois

he would have to have equal ownership of the business and equal say

why

what if he was lazy asf

and I kept him around to be nice

why is he your employee then

@Sorghagtani Beki then the rest of you vote him out of the company

I feel bad for him

then you're against the spirit of the business

if you feel bad for him why doesnt he have equal share

Because I don't feel that bad for him

only enough to give him a job

with minimum wage

he is so shitty

is is basically a basic income

because he does barely any work

then just give him money instead

what minimum wage this is a communist society in a undefined what if scenerio

it has to be done according to the circumstances

so does this lazy man get a fair share

maybe

who knows

:\

I think these things will become infinitely more clear once a movement actually happens

why would he be there tho? like this is confusing, and why would someone he not be lazy if you are taking the fruits of his labor

Like I said

I keep him around to be nice

I don't think revolutionaries should stick to dogmatic principles in class, but the goal is having a workers' economy

work rate is very low

whats his incentive to give a shit and not be lazy in the first place

he is lazy

not not lazy

who knows

@Sorghagtani Beki people won't focibly come and demand you to give him the rights. It is probably something that will now be possibly for him to do

but what incentive did he ever have to workk hard

who knows

not my problem

like why work hard for someone who pays min wage

I could just fire him

and he would be homeless

back to drugs

probably not in a post-revolutionary economy

which is the case here

he does not deserve a portion of my business

if anything I deserve something for tolerating him

You need workers to work for you

yes

my family does the work

he does barely anything

w/o him there would be no difference

Maybe not, but hten he will find somewhere else. Capitalism creates artificial unemployment. I have no doubt the """""job""""" market will be infinitely different post-revolution

why not? i mean you never even gave the chance t o be in a posistion where there is a reason to work hard, you pay min wage you get min effort what do you expect

again, not my problem

that's more like a peasant

I worry for myself and my family

and in this case I am feeling nice

but you are saying he doesnt deserve it cause he is lazy

but he does not deserve anything more

I already give him a job and wage

even though he does nothing

but there is no reason for him to exert more than min effort

you are creating a catch 22

In socialism he would have a job, good working hours and a full wage

I gave him a raise before

no change in work ethic

He is just a leech

but he'd be paid less if he worked less

I have to deal with him because I do not want him selling drugs on the block

then you're doing charity

I don't think you would have to worry about that post-revolution

does this guy deserve more than I already gave him

he does not even deserve this

but no boss and no employee would ever accept a decrease in pay as a option this whole scenerio is completely bananas

I decreased pay because the increase did not do anything

right now I could do anything with pay

because he is useless

I do not need him

but this happens in no reality

how do you know? Everything I have said is very possible

I could just feel bad for this man

but not bad enough to give him part of my business

the nature of business is exploitation

maybe he's a labour aristocrat

this man is my only worker

no its really not possible cultural etiquite and reality of capitalist society this scenerio never happens

everyone else is family

receiving part of the wages of other workers

I am talking in this scenario

what would happen?

but the scenerio is bananas

but it is possible

so sit down

In this scenario, this man does not deserve part of my business

If he tried to claim it illegally

he would be shot

but you can fire him when you want; in socialism as I said would be paid a little and the work would be ensured

legality is not a thing. we're talking revolution

your scenerio and arguments are really like unconnected, illogical and bananas

if anyone tried to confiscate my business

they will be shot

ok but they might shoot back friendo

are you a business owner?

let us say I am

a class overthrows another one

this 99% family business

No exploitation of anyone

If someone tried to confiscate it, they would be shot.

@Sorghagtani Beki reminder that even if you were to keep your buisness during post-revolution, there would be no way of keeping it going since teh market probably won't be a thing

if you have hired workers of course

do you as a business owner expect more than min effort for min wage?

for business and profit

one worker

only 1

and he is lazy

do you as a business owner expect more than min effort for min wage?

Workers work for raises

not the other way around

why are you trying to keep a buisness during revolution?

the people could forgive you

assuming revolution wins

My father owned it

I want to keep it around

and you could receive even more

@Sorghagtani Beki but there will be no economical grounds for it to survive

since you'd have the security of socialism and you wouldn't be pushed by the big bourgeoisie

businesses need workers, it makes no sense that we kiss the bosses asses

no-one to sell to

What if I sold very very good pickles

no one else sells them but me

I have something no one else has

and I am selling them

how would people buy them? money can be gone

Money would still be around

you might not be able to use the money anymore

pre revolution money

I would ask for this as payment

let's say people start buying

what would happen?

yes but even if someone buys for those money, then what would you do with them?

that person is in risk of proletarization

I will use it to bribe people

or buy stuff from other countries

but people don't care about those money, since they're now only usable to buy really erally good pickles

or buy from other people who sell things

so you are a criminal exploiting other criminals who have a interest in working hard for shit pay but arent doing it

oh and you love pickles

No

he has no interest in working hard

your scenerio is retarded

He has to prove it before I give a raise

if for some reason there are other buisnesses like yours who also accept those money, ten it wouldn't be a revolution, since the point is to seize those buisnesses and change the system

you need him why should he prove shit

Nope

I don't need him

I hire him for charity

then fire him and donat ehim money

but this is a communist society why would he work for you at a unfair wage

He would not

I am wondering if he would get a share of my business

when the revolution is over

then you're a litte bourgeois self-employed doing charity

like a cooperative

exactly your entire situation is completely bananas and makes no sense

so would he get a share or not

you just keep moving variables to prove a point in a dumb whatif scenerio

but your buisness would either get seized or die out because of the post-revolutionary ecomonics

there is no buisness we can take part of post-revolution

maybe

Yes, but I am asking if he would get a share

or if the profits of my business remain to me and my family alone

you have given no type of tendency this revolution is

there is nothing to get a share of

the entire economy has to be connected to a plan in some phase

What will be seized when this business is seized?

it could benefit you

he would get a share you wouldnt have a choice and you would be shot for running a retarded illogical nonexistentt completely bananas pickle shop

the ownership and social connections of production

in some abstract sense

Howdy do everyone

this will not be a problem in practicallity

What would change for me if my business was seized?

you would no longer "own" it

What do you mean by this? What exactly are you seizing?

I think it's the same

And what do you mean by giving a share to workers

you tell me friendowhat would you do\

he's describing a cooperative

but hiring 1 worker for charity

@Sorghagtani Beki depends on what kind of revolution, you still haven't stated any