Anyway

Bug chasing is obviously a behavior we shouldn’t promote culturally or even legally.

When I say legally, I mean spreading STD’s without the others knowing

I just want to clarify

Any argument about this must be subjective

Whether I agree or disagree is a matter of opinion. How many people agree or disagree is a matter of opinion.

Alright, fine, I will concede, however I assume we all want the survival of our civilization

Not everyone does so it isn’t objective

Sure we can have that argument

I don't see a greater objective value in anything, so even though I value our civilization, I understand that some people disagree

And this is not a new phenomenon by the way

I agree with you on that, I guess I’m what you would call a “moral nihilist”?

I’m not religious

I'm surprised I must say

I guess we learn something new about each other everyday

Lol

Anyway, my goal is to ensure the survival of my civilization, I understand that some people don’t want that, but their just a obstacle to deal with

Because we aren’t on the same team with fundamental goals opposing each other

I agree, and my argument would be that degeneracy is a bad thing, however I also believe that the way we stop it must be an overall improvement, otherwise we fail. And that overall improvement can be approached by different means, e.g. using history, or ethics, etc., or a combination of many arguments

I consider Ford's approach to the problem a guaranteed failure

I haven’t seen his approach to the problem, so I won’t make a comment on it.
But I think if we have our goal in mind we can better define it

He wants to make things illegal like for example the display of nude breasts in public

It’s something that isn’t just not productive, it’s also a very dangerous behavior that hurts everyone

Oh that

Yeah I’m guessing his biggest issue would be that 11 year olds can be nude

And I'd agree that 11 y/o shouldn't be allowed to show themselves nude in certain places

I know at 11 they really don’t have anything but there is suspicion of pedophiles and sexualization of children

Especially in the context of our culture

Sure, these things are relevant, however

I think there's a right approach and a wrong one, I believe the right approach is through first considering the obvious behavior of humans

Secondly, before we put any rules in place (i.e. law) we must also consider why the law is a good solution, and why it isn't

Most people are social, they want to fit in
Some want to stand out
Both is true

An argument in favor of the majority is a poor one in my opinion

They don’t have to be mutually exclusive in some cases, which is paradoxical

Just a curious thing to point out

Anyway go on

Agreed. I think that behavior such as display of nudity is perfectly natural, and to argue that it's wrong or right must be put into context, because nothing works without context.

Like the dose of a certain food is what either feeds us or instead kills us

The exact same food can do either

Likewise, strictly forbidding all public nudity may sound like a bad idea, strictly allowing all public nudity may also sound like a bad idea. But both of those ideas must be tested against reality. Our personal beliefs won't help us with that.

That's the core of my argument.

I'm an advocate of patriarchy, so obviously I would ban the shit out of such degeneracy

Well public nudity isn’t a good idea, since it might cause problems with pedophiles like previously stated. But also in other areas such as a husband and wife go out and the husband is caught look at a girls jugs or the wife is looking at a horse cock. This might cause unnecessary tension here, for no good reason.
Even with a girls milkers out this will make people lust

Which causes tension between gf and bf

Just as one example

I take core arguments of traditionalism as axioms, there are no arguments around it

People would be free to leave my state if they want

<:pepelaugh:544857300179877898>

Public nudity as I see it likely won't cause any problems besides offending some people

Ever wondered why it would offend those people?

Cause they're against freedom of expression?

No

"no"

Expression for me, not for thee

Are you pro Child Porn

No

Why are you against Freedom of Expression?

Pornography requires consent. Children can't consent.

Are you pro CP that is not made using any children, but is generated using, say, AI?

If it's not sold or otherwise distributed but kept privately, I don't see a problem with it

That’s a oof

Why are you against the Free Market?

We can't test every single file for authenticity, children require added layers of protection.

That's why we make blanket rules for them, and for others, to protect them.

We can easily test whether it is made using deepfake or not

No we can't, the amount of fakes flooding the market would be insurmountable.

But hold on

Let’s say we can

Moreover, the consumption of CP itself doesn't violate your standards @ETBrooD

Just as a hypothetical

The private consumption of CP can be tolerated, since I don't want to make pedo lives miserable, I just want to protect children.

Distill the art from the method, then it seems you are fine with it

Yes, as I expected

The problems arise when we lose the ability to protect children

It's not about punishing pedos, it's about protecting children

This has priority

It is about the degeneracy of the art form itself

Degeneracy in a vacuum is not harmful

Well while I have no personal problems with tormenting pedophiles, pragmatically we should still lock them up. Their a lose end that can attack children and have the motivation to do so

Protecting children is a bigger issue of course, but private matters also effects the society at large

Through civic order

No they don't affect society at large, that's a lie

Of course it does

I wouldn’t say a lie

It does not

The evidence is all around you

Disagreement in opinion rather

Prove to me that my private internet porn consumption affects society at large

What was considered the norm 15 years ago (disgust of faggots) will now be considered homophobia

Since it has been legalized and promoted by society

What

You're conflating two arguments

Porn has a lot of psychological effects on people and its mass sale has even more negative effects

I disagree

Prove me wrong

I can gather studies later on this topic

Tell me what the key argument of those studies is

Oh the effects of pornography on the psyche

Pornography has no negative effect on the psyche

But on the second point of mass consumption of porn, it has led to the proliferation of degeneracy in the masses