And the know-how

Why does sawing off the barrels make it more deadly

because organized crime was literally outgunning the cops

ROFLMAO OO Bucks

they had more money for machine guns

shit was wild

Short barrel = wider spread

it makes it less deadly

@Decimus_Pax_Britainnia spread and conceilability

but you can conceal it

yeah mob was like shooting back with BARs and other shit from WW 2 that came back

BAR was favored since its round tore cars to shit

wine makes my spelling funky

Tommy guns

@Vanguard this was in the 20s

You get less velocity, but you get a literal wall of lead

with the tommy gun and such

30s*

yeah but BAR didnt come back in vogue until after war

built so many

and so many came back and hit market

even army didnt adopt bar right away

the spread on a sawed off is not that significantly greater afaik

Is it?

it is

I've never even seen one

army didnt adopt the bar until last possible second

Wouldn't being shot with a normal shotgun close range be just as bad as being shot with a sawed off

the wad comes out earlier

greater spread also means less pellets in a given location, reduces lethality

its about the wad

@Decimus_Pax_Britainnia yes, but less barrel length lets the pellets spread further sooner

@Decimus_Pax_Britainnia it would be worse

you use that ultra close you are basically shooting a fist at someone

it wont actually spread as much

the spread makes it easier to hit someone close up

it doesnt spread all that much

It's a street fighting weapon

it stays in the wad longer

and hurt more people i guess

you can look at slow motion videos of shotguns being fired and see

Not practical in a real fight

its situational

But in a street fight it's deadly

same with combat/breaching shotguns

So it'd go all over you body instead of just spread in a small area of your body

Yeah shotguns are actually really specialized weapons

it doesnt quite go like that

its practical for walking up to someone, pulling it out of your coat, and blasting them from 10 feet away

thats how it was used

Ahh

the wad cone doesnt spread as much until later on

it oblitereates whatever is close

the spread didnt have much to do with it

You wouldn't take a hunting shotgun to a battle like you wouldn't take a tactical shotgun hunting

it was an assassination weapon

ITS THE WAD OF SHOT REEEE

WAIT SO TRUMP IS ENDING DACA

yes

IS THIS CONFIRMED

also shorter meant it was easier to handle inside

so far, yes

and non seperated wad of OO buck is woosh

can swing it about faster

then you've got the whole slug reality...

no more dreamers

punch a hole in your chest

Firing a slug out of a sawn off is retarded

now the cone wont generally speaking go through modern armor

@Decimus_Pax_Britainnia you want slugs or wax slugs

no doubt

but you will wish you were fucking dead

open the shell, fill with wax, close it

@Wraff if you're shooting it from close up like how it was used it wouldnt matter much

Not only will you not hit anyhting, you'll lose a ridiculous amount of velocity

punch holes through people

one of my NCOs was in bosnia, they wore the ranger assault armor plates that were steel

they went to raid a house

Yeah, but slugs aren't meant for using up close

some dude had a SxS 12 gauge

@erz1871 wax slugs are for poorfags

who dont want to buy slugs

no they arent lol

@NSJW they work.

they are for breach and specialized

theres no advantage to a wax slug over a slug

maybe for breach idk

Wax slugs?

Yes. There is. For breach.

but for breaching there's now dedicated rounds too

for rebound.

Wtf

THE BREACH SLUG IS A WAX SLUG GOD DAMN IT

You can put anything into a shotgun hull, decimus

just adds to the consideration of shotguns i thought

he went to open door and both barrels to chest through door lmao, he is like 5'5 and went like the matrix backwards

https://www.safariland.com/products/less-lethal/breaching-tools/tko-12-gauge-breaching-round-1012104.html

this uses compressed zinc powder

Look up Demolition Ranch on youtube

the new breaching rounds are all powdered metal

thats not what the mil issues

that channel is awesome

they issue a wax slug

His early videos have him loading shotguns with random shit laying around the house

or taofledermaus @Wraff

You can put literally anything into a shell

the ball bearing slug FTW

flew right through the porch railings and shit and into bushes

Yes, I love taofledermaus

Just use dragon breath rounds

Taofledermaus is a bit more professional

Which is why I didn't bring it up

lol

dragon breath is retarded

the wad of both barrels hitting his central plate just made him like go airborne backwards through a wood porch lmao

it looks cool

Demolition Ranch loads random shit in there, whereas taofledermaus uses purpose-made slugs and shot

Why

dragons breathis gay

it doesnt do anything

a big spout of flame will not actually do much damage compared to buckshot

If black ops one told me anything it's that dragon breath is literally the best thing

Taofledermaus will use machined slugs intended for testing,a nd Demolition Ranch will fucking put batteries in a shotgun hull to see what it does

The US military M1030 breaching round, a 12 gauge 2¾ inch (70 mm) shell which uses a 40 gram (1.4 ounce) projectile made of powdered steel, bound with wax.[2][3]
The Clucas MoE Hatton Round, a 12-gauge 3-inch (76mm) magnum shell which uses a 43 gram (1.5 ounce) frangible projectile, consisting of a high density wax binder.
[4]

Not that I don't enjoy both

its a firework

basically

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M26_Modular_Accessory_Shotgun_System

@Wraff ikr

So why don't you just use explosive rounds or something

@Decimus_Pax_Britainnia please dont talk about videogames

when referring to guns

I fucking love seeing what Taofledermaus's contributors will build. Some of the shit they've sent in is fucking devastating and horrifying

especially when its fucking COD

this is like a hugely cringe worthy stereotype

Kek I'm only joking

@Wraff oh fuck yes, the russian slugs

of people who dont know guns

carried one of these bad boys when we got called up for domestic response lmao

hnnnnnng

@Vanguard noice

Yeah, the Russian slugs are the most vicious things I've ever seen fired out of a shotgun

AY FAM COME RIOT PLZ

somehow missed taofledermaus sweet

And they put most purpose-built ammo to shame

@Vanguard thats barely a barrel

SO I CAN DUMP FIRE THIS FUCKING EXTENDED MAG

But yes why don't you just use explosive rounds

the breach bill is spring loaded and retractable

@Decimus_Pax_Britainnia because thats retarded

you dont need a long barrel its a combat shotgun

its for breaching @erz1871

even the stock drops off

you hold it right up to the door

@Decimus_Pax_Britainnia guns work by accelerating mass onto a target where the energy gets dumped

you literally can use it as a shotgun pistol or mount to M4

Why is it retarded

@Decimus_Pax_Britainnia because the rounds are too small to fit enough explosive into

it's overly complex

minimum practical size for an explosive shell is 20mm

^

there are tiny grenades with timing

thingy

and its just expensive

meh

whatsitscalled

Couldn't they do bigger damage than slugs though

jesus fuck

just use a 40mm 320

nope not really

Yeah, there's not really any practical purpose for an explosive shell

Fired out of a shotgun that is

It won't do anything that 00 buck won't

and yeah 40mm would be better

the advantage of the 20mm is that its a much higher velocity round

the 40mm is low pressure

Hmmm

they even make holsters for 320s for the ultimate side arm

40mm is basically a thrown rock

^^^

40mm will fuck your day up

There actually is a point where there's enough dakka

This is really revealing my lack of knowledge about guns

And anymore is superfluous

🇬🇧

Trust me decimus

tiny explosive rounds would not be that much more effective than solid ones, and way more fucking expensive AND dangerous to store

Everyone starts that way

I knew NOTHING about guns three years ago

you can't just have explosive shells laying around, even worse than ammo

This is my door opener

@NSJW corrosion is real

I can't imagine a way in which I'll know enough about guns to your point though

40mm isnt that hard to store

@Decimus_Pax_Britainnia dont you have gun clubs

Once guns become a hobby, you learn more

Not really

its actually pretty easy to store tbh

i didnt know that about 40mm

There's not really any gun ranges or anything like that here

it seems like a pretty idiot proof round

yeah

Due to lack of guns

it has to spin like 38 times to arm or some shit

Yeah it's not easy to make it a hobby when you live on cuck island

we were shooting them in like a hard core storm

yeah i cant wrap my head around how the arming mechanism works

and there was water on the range so we were skipping them across the range like stones lmao

we have some smart engineers

its inertia, it has to rotate X times to arm the round

@Vanguard lololololo

Why can't you guys just come over and invade us already

otherwise its a 40MM bullet

Like seriously

yeah i know how it works

which will still kill the shit out of you

but not the actual mechanism

but you can also shoot down and skip it and it will still arm at distance lmao

Tell Israel England was originally part of Zion

It might happen

I skipped one into a bunker target

like is there something that spins inside and then locks into place? idk

Oh gawd

slapped up and went in through window and hit inner roof and went off

YEE YEE

then me and my CO were having officerly duels with it, calling targets and firing it in pistol set up single handed

🤔

i always wonder why the military tried to introduce that retarded xm25 airburst thing, rather than adapt it to the 40mm

probably some general was invested into the company

it devolved into like joes trying to shoot trees and shit at end of range

@NSJW thats what i couldn recall

SMART GUN

was funny last year as deer ran across the MG range

SMURRRRT

OIC didnt call cease fire in time lmao

I was watching via thermal and looked like footage from predator

@Vanguard ded durr

50 cals split deer apart lmao

was coolest shit ever, and it was foggy/rainy and bodies were all steamy

well what was left

wish I had recorded off my thermal, someone has footage

lol isn't 308 enough

like a deer half like sails into the tree line

split in half

Why the fuck would you use a 50 cal on a deer

for most about anything yes @AureiPueri

That's just overkill to the max

we were shooting in the valley and the deer ran across a live machinegun range