Yeah but I want to actually be able to see a specialist

In Canada it takes months and even a year to see a specialist

Honestly violence never works.

xd look at Antifa.

They are violent and hardly anyone likes them.

the left like them

I don’t like them, but then I’m not left

@Neco2040 I don’t think you understood

I just debunked your myth around the government saving trillions in healthcare, but the people do not save trillions either

“Households and businesses would save nearly $15 billion in premium and out of pocket payments”

https://www.healthcare-now.org/296831690-Kenneth-Thorpe-s-analysis-of-Bernie-Sanders-s-single-payer-proposal.pdf

Not trillions but only 15 billion over the course of a decade

**"In general small businesses that do
not offer insurance today with 50 or fewer workers would face a 6.2% payroll tax
increase. Low income populations living in poverty receiving Medicaid would pay more
through the 2.2% income tax and 6.2 percent reduction in wages. "**

This also does not help the poor as they would lose MORE money.

And as I said again, this 15 billion is compared to the over regulated mess you have now. If the healthcare market was more free, it would cost much less.

Not to mention the other countries only few have single payer. But true most of universal. However there are countries with healthcare markets much freer than the US, Singapore and Switzerland. Both these countries rank in the top for the worlds best healthcare quality and prices are much cheaper than the US @Neco2040

Also waiting times too are much lower

You can't debunk a fact. According to your study, which I have no reason to trust over all the others, we would save money. Pretty much every other country with single payer pays less on healthcare than we do, and they have better quality.

Seniors have Medicare in the United States. There are several countries with single payer that have lower wait lines than we do. Every country rations care, the difference is, here it's based on money, and in most developed countries, it's based on necessity

All commies will swing

@sɪᴅɪsɴᴏᴛʜᴇʀᴇ

@Neco2040 See we're back again

Btw, you should tag me after you finish your argument

Like right now, I see your tag, but I might forget to come back and look at it when you finish making your argument

There is no "fact"
I said yes the people would say money, but not 2 trillion dollars. Only 15 billion.

**"Pretty much every other country with single payer pays less on healthcare than we do, and they have better quality."**
The US really beats them on quality and waiting times as we can see by the chart. In these very countries, medical care is rationed much more.

**"Seniors have Medicare in the United States."**
So? That doesn't change the wait times of hospitals.

**"There are several countries with single payer that have lower wait lines than we do. Every country rations care, the difference is, here it's based on money, and in most developed countries, it's based on necessity"**
Except these are all the single payer countries, apart from Denmark. The countries with single payers are on the red, these are the countries that have the highest wait times out of the lot.

Not every country rations care, only inefficent state run ones. The US doesn't ration healthcare, other freer market healthcare systems like Singapore and Switzerland don't ration healthcare either and definitely not on money.

Most of the medical innovation really comes from the united states

funnily enough thats one of the least regulated out of the healthcare market

So you concede that we would pay significantly less under a single payer system? I'm not sure since you didn't really respond to that point

And it's simply not true that we have better quality. If you have to go to the hospital, they will take you here and in those countries. The difference is you won't go bankrupt in most developed countries

I said that above

We're not measuring cost, we're measuring quality

cost has no metric in this field

I said they pay less under the system we have now

And I just said, if you need help immediately, you will get it in both countries

How is that relevant to quality?

However thats not always true haha, broken legs. My friend had to wait 5 hours in A&E once in uk

@Neco2040 And remember only few countries have a single payer system

That's the main issue we are worried about, right?

Mhm?

How long they will have to wait for an emergency?