when there's no other option, say in sweatshops

So, OK. but parse this fact: LABOR IS VOLUNTARY.

Well hey, you're a wage laborer and this is what you prepared for. It's quite simple really, harder you work the better outcome you get. You always had the opportunity to approach a different future and pathway for your future job. People who work hard in college, put in time searching, have good academics and invest their money and time smartly will become more successful than those that dont

Its fair, its simple, its good

Harder you work results in the amount you receive

A+

and the more rewarding the end result is, that's fair, that's capitalism

*than

***socialism on the other hand***

no it isn't, wage labour should be abolished, your literally depending your life with it, if your job gets offshored your discarded and ignored, and it isn't as simple as working harder and getting more profit, it would be a glorious society if we had that, but no, that is as equivalent as your argument about socialism being good on paper.

what happens when your job gets offshored?

your employmwnt and education and housing is guaranteed under socialism

your depending on a ceo and a bureaucratix elite for your wage

and if they ignore you, your a piece of discarded human rubbish.

In a way, this sets up Trump for a MORE defensible position in 2020.

trump supports automation lol

your life depends on wage labour

and if its profitable to offshore jobs, what happens?

Well you have the free will and opportunity to choose whether, 1. Go with the flow, continue and put your trust in this offshore job and trust it will be the better of your family. 2. Or have the free will to choose whether you want a different job, from a different company, or really anything from there. Usually something in a similar field, and it's your choice. The fact of the matter is, socialism as you state would not work in our reality

you won't have that under socialism, because your employment is guaranteed

Thus resulting in it being only good, on paper

@TheBestGangster that trust is gone lol, you can't predict the labour market

oops. +++MY+++ life depends on automaton..

So basically, in socialism it boils down a lack of work and competition

so basically, you just ignored my entire argument about jobs being offshored

because its profitable to offshore them

your ignored

Don't even have to work to get a job, housing

All supplied to you

Competition? No such thing in socialism

What drives the market?

No damn clue

yes you do, under socialism if you don't work the state has no obligation to serve you.

"offshored"l "automated". Difference?

there would be no markets under socialism, there would be no need for competition as all these engineers and such workers would be employed to serve the state, which gives the state more resources to function

@Fere Nemo when did I say they were in any way had correlation?

@Leiro レイロ Actually when you get rid of competition it gets rid of a purpose to work harder. Like if you're running a race with nobody, what's the damn point. There is no motivation, thus resulting in a slowness of progress (and if this was capitalism, a tremendous lack of profit)

Which is what puts other people at a bigger advantage than you, but in socialism that cant happen because theres no competition to begin with

there would be lol, it would be like "why do I have to work 12 hours a day if I can work two?", under socialism innovation makes your labour expended more productive, and thus people will be working lesser than they used to

and this could be argued to be a stump, blocking point in technology

look at innovation in the USSR