So socialism is of course not *just* wealth REdistribution (emphasis on RE, because it's about involuntary distribution, i.e. using force/coercion rather than negotiation), as I have also said so myself.

Every single socialist policy is socialist, but of course the whole country can still be considered capitalist if the sum of all policies are more capitalist than socialist.

So therefore "socialism is xyz" as a complete package of set ideas paints a false picture of what socialism is, as there is a wide range of policies that would be considered socialist, and the argument that a country can only be either-or, and not a mix between capitalism and socialism, is wrong.

At which point exactly a country should be considered capitalist or socialist (how many socialist policies must be or must not be in place) isn't something that has been decided by anyone, it's just a label to roughly identify a country's sum of its policies.

E.g. most people would argue the US is more capitalist and should therefore be considered a capitalist country. But others would argue that it has so much socialism that it should be considered mixed.

An example that demonstrates why the amount of wealth redistribution is so crucial in deciding the label of capitalism or socialism is if taxes are raised to 100% for example. In such a case it'd be abundantly clear that the country must be considered mainly socialist because no capital ever gets to be private in the first place. Even with the means of production in private hands it would be overwhelmingly socialist.
Likewise if the means of production are entirely collectivized, even if taxes are at 0% it would have to be considered a mostly socialist country.

I personally would argue that redistribution of wealth brings more socialism than collectivization of the means of production does.

But that'd be more an example of it not being always obvious what constitutes more/less socialism.

Sweden is actually a very socialist country, not entirely, but far more than many other European countries. Denmark is even more socialist.

This is where the debate between socialists and capitalists often fails, because both sides often fail to consider other influences besides the economic system. Natural resources, culture, socio-political situation, etc. etc. etc.

Ugh, wow. I succinctly laid it out for and you reply with confused ways to keep changing the meanings of words instead of refuting any point with clear and argumentation. I give up. Stay a socialism apologist with your word salads, enjoy.

I'm not changing the meaning of words, could you please back that claim up?

I'm not apologizing for socialism either, wtf are you even thinking?

I'm one of the most staunch proponents of capitalism

donald trump is a fascist

did you guys watch the latest short fat otaku video ?

its pretty interesting, and explains many of the talking point regarding facism and socialism, in a rather eloquent way

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9mJPw-ICYp8

@FridgeNuker. If by FASCIST you mean a guy who likes getting rid of regulations that deny freedom and cost people $$$, he's guilty.

If, on the other hand, by fascist you mean he has the characteristics of radical, authoritarian ultranationalism, with dictatorial power, forcible suppression of opposition, and strong regimentation of society and of the economy, you're a bit off.

I don't think he is serious , no one can say Trump is a facist with a straight face

I figured he was kidding

That's why I didn't go for engaging in a debate

I mean, the biggest threat the US faces is how the left twists language

Language creates reality

and that should be a priority when looking into what will happen with your country

It's the underlying Marxism/postmodernism that facilitates that language issue.

That's why I am very clear with my definitions

exactly

thats how they managed to fuck our country in the current crisis

So does that Crowder guy. Before he starts debating, he makes sure there are clear, agreed on definitions.

every number said we were doing great

but they create a reality in which numbers and data don't matter

everyone they dont like is a nazi or a facist

they consider china and venezuela to be perfectly viable "goverments" and yet criticise any use of police force

once language has been transformed, and adopted by the masses, it feels like you are trying to convince a crazy person he is not Napoleon, like a lovecraft reality , nothing makes sense

They believe identity is socially constructed. So, they think if they call you a fascist then you magically are one.

I feel the US is strong enough to avoid a major fall, like what happens in the US, but i think thats at a federal level, I fully expect some states to fall into the same traps we did, Oregon, Washington and California come to mind

i want to see two primary things happen with trump in his second term, 1) two more supreme court seats and a few hundred more lower level judge appointments. 2) Major focus on debt and deficit reduction. Those two things will make it so i know socialists won't get their way here while i'm alive.

I don't think you can reduce deficit

Trump likes bieing liked, and those kind of measures are always unpopular