Message from @SYDWAD

Discord ID: 602458975652413457


2019-07-21 11:04:51 UTC  

but the rest of the economy isn't built for communism as result of scarcity for other product

2019-07-21 11:05:50 UTC  

and in a world where every individual can have their own means of production and have the information to replicate product, product devaluation would ensue

2019-07-21 11:07:50 UTC  

first point no, since its harder for one person to get it than another its not post.
And i go back to the production, just because there is enough doesn't mean its as simple as "stop this group from *hording* it and give it to those with less" if the only reason there is more is because those with the ability want to make use of it in some way, its not just sitting not being used and free to reditribute like someone owning a lake next to a dying town

2019-07-21 11:09:07 UTC  

Yes it's harder under a market economy

2019-07-21 11:09:22 UTC  

not under a gift economy

2019-07-21 11:09:42 UTC  

and it's not 'stop this group from hoarding'

2019-07-21 11:09:57 UTC  

it's more construct a society where hoarding isn't necessary as goods are devalued

2019-07-21 11:09:58 UTC  

same with money, the reason the 1% have so much is because they make it year after year for their own wants. if you take it they will stop producing it because there is no point, working to the lowest speed to maintain your life with no room to improve

2019-07-21 11:10:13 UTC  

Right and what about worker co-ops?

2019-07-21 11:10:22 UTC  

do worker co-ops involve stealing from bosses?

2019-07-21 11:11:29 UTC  

im searching it now but im not familiar with worker co-ops

2019-07-21 11:11:44 UTC  

It's a business where the workers are also the owners of the business

2019-07-21 11:11:56 UTC  

a popular example is the mondragon corporation

2019-07-21 11:12:15 UTC  

all profit from the business goes back to the workers and to investment

2019-07-21 11:12:17 UTC  

rather than to a owner

2019-07-21 11:12:25 UTC  

who then delegates a portion of his profits to the workers

2019-07-21 11:13:35 UTC  

The point is i'm not trying to steal, but I'm trying to do what worker co-ops do: build the infrastructure to make it such that it is unnecessary to have a boss. In this case it is unnecessary to hoard

2019-07-21 11:13:51 UTC  

I'm a voluntaryist so I would never coerce someone to take their property and redistribute it

2019-07-21 11:14:03 UTC  
2019-07-21 11:15:43 UTC  

There are different models of worker co-ops but they all have one thing in common which is removing the need for the singular owner role

2019-07-21 11:16:52 UTC  

my problem with that is it easily becomes bloated and stagnant, even on small scales, you see this with any small town. If someone has the ability to make and run an empire they should have the right to do so. This for me falls on the side if me wanting more individual freedom. Less limitations to a person the better so long as it doesnt hamper the same or safety of another

2019-07-21 11:17:22 UTC  

people can from the pooled resources in a post-scarcity society

2019-07-21 11:17:32 UTC  

but this is assuming post-scarcity

2019-07-21 11:18:11 UTC  

It's not that I want to restrict currency or purchasing, I just want to build a platform where it would be unnecessary and counter-productive to do so

2019-07-21 11:18:20 UTC  

but if someone owns them then its not post, you still have to trade in some way to obtain what somone else has

2019-07-21 11:18:54 UTC  

by forcing limitations on something you are restricting it

2019-07-21 11:19:27 UTC  

right and hoarding is unnecessary if such action prevents yourself from gaining from a shared pool

2019-07-21 11:19:47 UTC  

such behaviour can be repressed in the same way gifting is repressed in a market economy

2019-07-21 11:20:15 UTC  

its like saying "you have free speech but we will fine you for using it" its not free

2019-07-21 11:20:22 UTC  

How am I fining?

2019-07-21 11:20:27 UTC  

example

2019-07-21 11:20:36 UTC  

It's like saying: I have my property and you have to abide by my rules if you want to be on my property

2019-07-21 11:20:45 UTC  

is that not in accordance with property rights?

2019-07-21 11:21:06 UTC  

Inaction is not fining

2019-07-21 11:21:23 UTC  

social ostracism is an effective means of utilising collectives in a way that is not unethical

2019-07-21 11:22:05 UTC  

its no different than the ancaps that preach of the ancap and then argue that shooting someone in your lawn may cause your community to disassociate yourself from such cruelty if they see fit

2019-07-21 11:22:29 UTC  

It's like saying shutting my ears or not giving you good treatment for what you said is the same as silencing you

2019-07-21 11:22:46 UTC  

by artificially making it harder to do x you are limiting x
The pure capitalism works the way it is because of human nature, if you alter it to make it harder to run a company on your own thats an artificial limitation and its no longer free

2019-07-21 11:22:53 UTC  

Lol

2019-07-21 11:23:04 UTC  

It doesn't have to be and it really isn't

2019-07-21 11:23:10 UTC  

Capitalism has had many different iterations