I guess

Yeah

Because Juche_pride wasn't as funny

Eh LCU is getting some Salem Witch Trial levels of paranoia

Self reliance is essential

I think this is worthy of a spread https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21343349

@Dragonspirit223#0358 that's why you have to seize the means of production and be able to sustain yourself with the value of your own labor

How to build a Moon Base

https://news.bitcoin.com/why-central-banks-are-not-designed-for-democracies/

And yet y'all wonder why people oppose them and there associated organizations/systems

People who oppose banks and credit unions may keep the money in their pay cards, and use the money to pay bills and donate money and buy things.

Why would You forgo a paycheck and let companies keep your income 😆

BTW pay cards run through the same banks that you pretend to have a problem with

Any use of fiat currency is enabling central banking.

https://ammbr.com/

@Ulithian then that leaves us with a question to answer

Since crypto at least as we know it is currently completely devoid of privacy and security

Fiat is not a ethical option

And trade barter systems are limited to local economies( for some reason)

So what kind of currency or money system would be valid? @Ulithian

GG @SHEPARD D☭G, you just advanced to level 10!

Most coins are pseudo-anonymous, which means you have to handle with care like conventional fiat
Some coins are purpose built to be very privacy conscious like, monero, dash, zcash and zcoin.

To me it is the most realistic option so far.

Plus so far the main loss of anonymity for crypto comes into play with fiat-crypto transactions.

Also I know you are attached to the Idea of barter. But you need to understand it's limitations to be able to use it effectively.

Firstly, the double coincidence of wants.

Secondly, the indivisibility of value.

Thirdly, lack of standards for deferred payments.

Lastly, Difficulty in storing wealth.

Most of these can be worked around with a significant network of willing participants.

The problem is finding willing participants.

Most of you willing participants will be on the local level because if you try it outside of your local area, you now have the additional overhead of postage or freight. If you are doing it yourself, fuel and other wear and tear on your vehicle.

Not to mention you now have to pay twice for postage or freight.

Damn mee6, can’t give @Ulithian a level for that

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@Ulithian nothing says that the barter can't come to a pseudo currency such as trading in oil( basically could be handled the same way as trading with gold and silver except it's legitimately useful to the economy and any form of inflation requires further investment into Industries revolving around the creation of such fuels ... plus as a useful externality at least standard petrol does expire after about a year which makes it harder for lazy people to just ride on old money)


However yes I never said that Bater is perfect
just that it's preferable when compared to the other options of either giving up your anonymity or supporting a state bureaucracy

.

Something else I just kind of thought of is most currencies would fall under the Coincidence of wants

Like If I bring 60000000 yen to a American Store I'm not going to get very far

Yeah but it's enforced as legal tender nationally.

So that makes it kind of standardized and convertible

And we kind of lose that Advantage depending on which cryptos we're trying to set up our economy with

Yeah anything can be used as commodity money, some better than others.

Oil can count, but left by itself it would be replaced by gold.

Problem is that its inability to hold value over time penalises it.

Yeah I agree certain entities are gonna want the hording ability

That's kind of why I like the idea of oil having a expiration date

Like these people don't really add much to the economy just by hoarding money

So if it's a use-it-or-lose-it type of game they are incentivized to keep the money flowing ( be it investing that into agriculture of farm equipment or running city buses longer distances which serves more customers or just trading it for useful items that someone had to make and is now getting paid for basically you could come up with any example you want)

And if they lose it then that just opens up the market to people who are further down on the food chain to step up

Yeah I agreed that for this reason the powers-that-be are not going to like it and getting them to do so would basically be a Fool's errand it's just kind of a thing I think would be nice

I think this is keynesian logic here.

Saving is important for a healthy economy, for starting large projects and for providing capital to banking/credit unions to provide loans to people who need it.

Saving or better said investing is very important indeed. If someone 'hoards' money, it'll be -after some time- like the person burned the money, but by all means its out of circulation, and also its not invested anywhere which is isn't very helpful to the owner of the money.

@Ulithian but Kenzie ins don't want economic growth they just want more spending without thought put into what the externalities of that spending will be

I almost forgot to take into account their idea of spending loaned money instead of owned money

You can still save up for something in a year it's not like we're talking about beans or cabbage that'll go bad before the week is over

In either case you are forced to spend your wealth before it loses its value.