Um. Not true. That claim is established from scripture itself

It’s at the end of revelations.

Who determines what writings are scripture?

which is all claims from men, stating they have been visited by God, and that they have portrayed His word accurately

Because most the Bible was canonized by a group of pagans and Christians.

Lol

That one is funny

do you just not have an answer to the problem, @Legalize ?

@Legalize that's complicated and tends to be shaped and evolved on by different societies.

I do know that genocide, certainly fits the immoral category

Because we have thousands of years of testing and philosophy that have found it's detrimental to the human race, and fosters constant war, which leads to massive human suffering.

Morality is subjective. Even amongst Christian's anyways.

Because immoral is subjective. Why is something that would be immoral bad?

Because of the negative outcome.

Increased population through rape isn't good for society.

well you just intruduce another hoop you need to jump through what does it mean an negative outcome?

Why do I want what sustains the human race or society?

@ThePortugueseGuy negative outcomes are pretty measured. Increased wealth, reduced suffering, scientific progress, etc...

You can’t just assert moral claims as an axiom.

>nobody could solve the problem

does the killing of the ones who are suffering constitute a positive or negative outcome

Yeah they're expecting me to solve it for them. I'm not claiming morality has to be absolute. You guys are.

irt's another gray line on the sand

@ThePortugueseGuy that can't be answered in a vacuum.

My moral standards line up relatively close to modern Christianity.

I'd argue mine are stricter.

can you DJ_anuz explai why is the God of the old testament different of the God of the new

NT: turn the other cheek, sacrifice yourself for the greater good, do unto others as you would have done into you.

OT: an eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth. Genocide is okay, because you need land and have been oppressed, do an ordinance even slightly out of line and I'll kill you.

It's why the Jews expected a conquer when Christ came. Not a pacifist.

That doesn't answer the question of why we christians think that is the same God

i want you to steel man the christian argument if you can

I can do it for you

The strongest steel man argument I know of is that the Jews at that time couldn't handle the gospel. Moses was supposed to bring the gospel Christ taught to the Israelites, but when he found them worshipping the golden calf, broke the tablets, and went back up to commune with God. That's why the were given the lesser law, or the Levitical Law. The law that Christ taught was the law held by priests after the order of Melchizedek. So God didn't change, but his people did.

I think you are a bit far

look from my stand point

@DJ_Anuz That's an interesting argument. I have nothing to contribute except that at the moment tbh

I'm one of those nerds that gets a hard on from Leviticus Numbers and Deuteronomy.

(You will need to apologize the broken English in here)It goes something like this, God made us perfect. We decide to sin against God. God always knew this and made us any way. God always had a redemption plan for humanity. God himself would die on a cross for us.

That does track

Much of the Bible is humans screwing up somehow

It still has a glaring problem imo. How do we not know that the law we currently have is only a stepping stone to the true gospel? Christ intended to have the 12 apostles continue calling new apostles to replace themselves.

Christians have to accept that their current moral standards are likely inferior to what would be revealed when Christ comes again.

And that still doesn't instill confidence in the consistency of Christian/religious morals if it's dependent on what morality humans can accept.