@SteelandSouls voting gives us our say. We can’t do anything about the Saudis

That's all well and good but when you look at cases like McCaskill and the Federal Reserve, and the unaccountable bureaus, and the lack of term limits, and government spending, what part of that is our say? Then you expect us to have say over what would essentially be a major power source of the country?

That reminds me I see Discord made some TOS changes, and I apparently need to opt out of something. Have you guys already done this?

@SteelandSouls I would rather try changing the US with my legal ability than trying to change Saudi Arabia with my not legal ability.

@SteelandSouls plus, you can buy an electric vehicle and charge it with solar panels you put on your property and nobody can stop you.

@grant no, I can’t remember doing that

@Salacious Swanky Cat wanna bet? re: solar panels

@Agent Smith I’m not saying it would be easy or cheap, I’m saying you can do it.

same with rainwater tanks

@Agent Smith well, again with rainwater. It’s possible, but that doesn’t mean it’s cheap.

going off-grid has gotten people in trouble the power company cuz they expect you pay cuz their power lines go past your house - I think it was a case in florida

Wouldn't it be easier to stall for a decade when solar is cheap and plentiful?

/reliable

@Agent Smith there’s a difference between grid tied and off grid. I’d have to see why that case may have happened.

If you collect rainwater, will the EPA try to regulate under the clean water and air act? 🤔

also in some places, you don't have the water rights to catch your own rain

WHAT?

Lol

@grant actually no. The epa doesn’t regulate residential well water.

A lot of states actually disallow the collection of rainwater

Are there rules against the collection of air too?🤪

Apparently Nestle once tried to obtain the sole rights of selling water

@SteelandSouls those are states. The feds don’t prevent it.

#License2Breathe

some libtards are trying to make that case for paying to have clean air

I've heard that if a puddle forms on your property some government entity (maybe the EPA) can claim its a wetland. Does anyone know if that's true?

watermelon environmentalists - green on the outside, red on the inside

Problem with that exception is that these same state who you are trying to ween off of oil to move to electric to include solar panels, are dealing with laws like this that pose the same risk as farming your own energy.

@grant depends on where you live. Some states define state waters differently. The states that disallow rainwater collection are typically in the West.

@Agent Smith several are and it drives me crazy.

@SteelandSouls there are zero federal laws that prevent people from going off grid and there are no state laws against it. However, municipal laws are questionable. If you live in a municipal co-op you may be prevented.

An example of municipal laws raising an issue.

@SteelandSouls that is in my state. Holy crap. I actually know people living off the grid in my state. It seems like the problem for this guy wasn’t explicitly going off the grid with electricity. He violated building codes and stuff like that. I don’t know if Huntsville forces people to tie into the sewer/water system. If he is in the TVA service area, they can’t prevent him from going off grid with power.

@Salacious Swanky Cat I’m with @SteelandSouls here, on a bigger picture note. Let’s say the ideal goes for the US (in your scenario) and the place is completely self-reliant for energy resources. What about the rest of us in the developed world?

Frankly, considering we can’t even legally collect rainwater without an EPA-approved tank, farm solar without an EPA-approved set of panels, or even go “off-grid” (because every bit of unclaimed land is automatically federal property here)... are you proposing to go total isolationist and just fly the double middle fingers to the rest of the world?

@Agent Smith So are you saying, some people watched Space Balls, and wanted to be the bad guys in it? (Clean Air joke).

@Shadows Total Recall had the same villain evil archplan

Also, China is already on that train mates

Selling clean air by the bottle

🤔 I was a kid when I saw that in the theatre so I forgot that bit lol

@Deleted User lol. Not isolationist. I made the point that shifting from oil to electricity for transportation puts the US government above fuel rather than opec. He decided that was still problematic and I said go off grid if you don’t want any government. The point I was making is that it’s better for us to use electric vehicles because we have more control as citizens in the us and zero control with opec. The same applies for Australia.