God has sovereignty still. I’m still trying the work out where the line is.

So what's your stance on predestination?

@Beemann what counts as evidence for God?

@Beemann "claims to the contrary usually operation on some presuppositional level"
right, and as Salacious & I laid out with our "everything requires faith" bit, everything we do requires presupposition

well what would you provide as evidence?

and the difference is that if you presuppose that 1 is a number and 2 of them equate to 2, that fits into a system with predictive power

I take Brad Stine's stance on the matter. Any God I can prove is not a God I'd want to believe in

so unless this is all a cleverly created simulation where things are explicitly created to work not the way they should, it can be assumed things work in this way for a reason. Further still, there's less reason to believe the former is the case anyway

I want to go running but it's 45° outside

@SteelandSouls Lets see. I believe that God is all knowing and sovereign, which means he already knows everyone’s fate. It’s hard to say what actually is happening, but the Bible implies both to some extent. Still thinking it through.

It's generally known in the bible we can't know the mind of God. And I wouldn't even call it a mind necessarily, because that's personifying God's nature

we mistakenly do that too often

@Beemann In the Bible, God promises to Abraham that he will make him the father of many nations (genesis 17:6). The abrahamic faiths have completely dominated the world. More so than any other religion. Does that count as predictive power?

depends on how you define a nation

@SteelandSouls you get the point.

I get the gist of it

More importantly, any good ideas for crackers and cream cheese?

@Salacious Swanky Cat not when every religion predicts its spread, no

@Beemann yeah. The all claim it. Which have produced the best results? Abrahamic faiths.

Sup

wut

Everyone predicts they will win the race, one person did, ergo they are a prophet <- basically what is being argued here

@Beemann that’s an example of predictive power.

That's more an example of being wrong until someone is right

it's not, it's a guess. There's no model upon which you're consistently coming out with the same result via the same process

exactly

How do know it’s a guess?

whats the predictive model, and how many times has it been replicated?

Frequency and commonality of what is attempted to be predicted

Replicated? Are we entering into multiverse theory? lol

ohhh dear

no?

The predictive model is an individual believing and it has been replicated enough to where it’s the dominant faith system.

"I predict a coin flip, I have a formula that says what it will be"
do it once = not really special
do it 1mil times = you might have something

thats not replication of the prediction

"I predict you will have a lot of fans" != every fan is replication

having a lot of fans, in total, is one instance of it occurring

make it happen again

@Salacious Swanky Cat I have 1 small issue with what you said, and 1 big problem with what you said. The small one being, atheism can be defensible. The second being

Nothing I Say Has FLAWS!

Yeah that's incoherent, or we're talking about two different things