Message from @Beemann

Discord ID: 620784762339983390


2019-09-10 00:43:16 UTC  

What do you mean by limit the state "completely"?

2019-09-10 00:43:41 UTC  

to prevent it from being capable of tyranny

2019-09-10 00:43:48 UTC  

If anything, libertarianism opens the door for social conservatives to shine, no?

2019-09-10 00:43:54 UTC  

You can't do that

2019-09-10 00:44:08 UTC  

right, that's what I'm saying

2019-09-10 00:44:09 UTC  

You can limit tyrannical capacity, but you can never eliminate it

2019-09-10 00:44:27 UTC  

Libertarianism is based on that principle

2019-09-10 00:45:14 UTC  

So long as you're still allowing a government you are creating an easy target for power accumulation and centralization, which is why vigilance must be a focus

2019-09-10 00:45:59 UTC  

But it's not a social plan, that has to be decided by communities

2019-09-10 00:46:34 UTC  

Which is where you can make your social ideology shine, if it works as well as you suggest
That's a general "you" fwiw

2019-09-10 00:47:28 UTC  

Hm?

2019-09-10 00:50:27 UTC  

Are you thinking of a Libertarian government?

2019-09-10 00:50:40 UTC  

Because a libertarian government could be one of several configurations

2019-09-10 00:52:17 UTC  

You could have one of several kinds of democracy, there's also theories that emerge from prior authoritarian rule, not unlike commieshit (though I'm not a fan of those)
You dont even necessarily have to make franchise universal. It all depends on how you wanna argue rights really

2019-09-10 00:53:39 UTC  

^^^^

2019-09-10 00:53:44 UTC  

I see that said a lot but I think it mostly comes down to the libertarian answer being "people will have to figure it out"

2019-09-10 00:54:04 UTC  

Like do I know the exact solution every community will take to a given issue? No. Some of them will even make bad decisions

2019-09-10 00:54:34 UTC  

But I think it's important that, so long as fundamental principles aren't being violated, that people should be free to do dumb shit

2019-09-10 00:54:39 UTC  

And then pay for the consequences

2019-09-10 00:56:14 UTC  

People are prevented from particular solutions due to arbitrary law

2019-09-10 00:57:00 UTC  

People are free to rescind their rights on an individual basis no matter what

2019-09-10 00:57:28 UTC  

But the goal should be to restore a system under which states are separate and people have those rights

2019-09-10 00:57:39 UTC  

Or do you feel you have a better solution?

2019-09-10 00:58:37 UTC  

Both, in their own way. US States should regain their rights, nations shouldn't be shoved into collectives like the EU

2019-09-10 01:00:48 UTC  

You can enter a collective, you should not be forced into it

2019-09-10 01:02:39 UTC  

It's pretty clear that the EU is a series of slow creeping agreements designed to erode sovereignty, bolstered by economic threats

2019-09-10 01:03:03 UTC  

Are we going to descend into spergery here?

2019-09-10 01:04:38 UTC  

I'm using nation to refer to the state https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_(polity)

2019-09-10 01:06:02 UTC  

I'll let you guess :^)

2019-09-10 01:08:31 UTC  

I'm not going to bother if you're going to be deliberately obtuse, particularly when you haven't outlined your alternative

2019-09-10 01:10:33 UTC  

Where my syndicalists at?

2019-09-10 01:10:33 UTC  

The first sentence describes a category, the second describes a disagreement, the third provides a definition

2019-09-10 01:11:37 UTC  

A state at its core is a compulsory organisation with a monopoly on force

2019-09-10 01:12:46 UTC  

I dont find that question relevant

2019-09-10 01:12:59 UTC  

The reality is that they do

2019-09-10 01:13:54 UTC  

That's not being obtuse. It doesn't matter if they should or shouldn't being that it seems to be a consistent outcome to form a state

2019-09-10 01:14:14 UTC  

Legalize did your boyfriend dump you or something? You're behaving worse than me on a Friday night.

2019-09-10 01:16:24 UTC  

No it doesn't, because I find the shoulds and shouldnts of it irrelevant. I'm interested in the specific structure insofar as it has to be lived in

2019-09-10 01:16:25 UTC  

I mean, what even is a state, really?

2019-09-10 01:16:32 UTC  

See above :^)

2019-09-10 01:17:07 UTC  

If I got the same results with a state as without, or vice versa, that would make little difference to me