Freeloaders just drag society down and leave it in depravity, we see it time and time again in history.

And again, what did I say earlier about those who deserve help?

It seems that if everyone was supported in applying their talents and skills "freeloading" would be at a minimum.

But that is a reality that is impossible to live in.

Also another good term for 'freeloader' is the 'ruling class'

Okay, and why is that?

they make our laws and refuse to pay taxes while ripping off their workers

that sounds much worse then 3 guys on welfare

They do pay taxes though? And I have seen that most businesses today give people nice benefits, as long as you are not working at some shit as hell place.

And when did I say I was against welfare?

@Deleted User for a buisness to be profitable by defintion you have to oppress your workers

I said I was against freeloaders.

Do you know what surplus value is?

By definition? Not so much.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/profitable

Maybe by YOUR definition.

without labor enterpreneuship doens't have value.

Also known as theft

If you want to defend capitalism, you have to defend that as well and then we can have a more legitimate discussion

Entrepenure ship is about starting businesses, do you know what you are talking about?

I ain't defending capitalism one bit, what I am doing is stating that your beliefs are shit.

How does it steal from workers again?

@Deleted User surplus wealth is a form of waste and then the capitalists sits around contributing nothing to society and distorting social and power relations between people who would otherwise be equals

It is theft plain and simple

that is the core of capitalist society

How is it a form of waste? It's a good thing, and it also means you can spend a lot of it.

How is it theft though?

Let's say a guy goes and buys a restaurant and puts a manager there who do all the hiring and logistics. The restaurant has 10 employees, who get's on average 10 usd per hour. Let's say the restauran in a week makes 15k of profit. The 10 employees combined make 4k a week and the owner makes 11k. The 10 employees do ALL the work in this scenario and the owner does none at all. Who generates the value?

Is it you the worker or the person who does nothing?

Woudlen't the owner? Because he was the person who personally organized the construction of the building, the set up and founding of the business, the management of it, and the eventual expansion of it, in which he has to hire people who will generate a profit for him, which will give him money to expand his business, while also giving his workers benefits, more time off, and less hours.

Let me tell you, the owner just dosen't collect it and tell the workers to piss off, no he actually has to spend it back into the company, which will then go back to the workers one way or the other, be it benefits, unions, or whatever.

The only jobs that don't offer this are part time, low effort and low paying jobs, in which your job is pretty much expendable, and has little worth at all.

That or CHINESE and VIETNAMESE jobs.

(Ironically, from so called communist countries.)

Fine you should be rewarded for taking risk. But rewarded in perpetuity?

BTW I have to leave Gn comrade

What do you mean by that?

Good evening leftypol, what are we debating today?

@killsometime#2709 Your ass.

hm