Message from @Garbage

Discord ID: 598516485589172234


2019-07-10 14:01:56 UTC  

Our thoughts accelerate far ahead of our biology.

2019-07-10 14:02:33 UTC  

Biology is not fundamentally differnt each time

2019-07-10 14:02:38 UTC  

are you even ...

2019-07-10 14:02:55 UTC  

Do you know how genetics works

2019-07-10 14:02:57 UTC  

And I agree with you there. I'm saying that biology cannot keep up.

2019-07-10 14:03:06 UTC  

with markers and such being passed on to the offspring

2019-07-10 14:03:12 UTC  

resulting in simular offspring

2019-07-10 14:03:16 UTC  

No gene codes for the paradoxical loop.

2019-07-10 14:03:36 UTC  

That's why I said: "Our thoughts accelerate far ahead of our biology."

2019-07-10 14:03:38 UTC  

Yeah i dont know what you mean by that

2019-07-10 14:03:54 UTC  

you have to explain what your "idea" of of that is

2019-07-10 14:04:29 UTC  

It was all very clear. Thoughts explode into potential infinities, and they can be pushed infinitely further than manipulations of our genes can.

2019-07-10 14:04:43 UTC  

So there is no one-to-one correspondence between genes and thoughts.

2019-07-10 14:04:58 UTC  

In other words, no combinations of genes can be said to cause a certain thought.

2019-07-10 14:05:38 UTC  

This is an entirely different kind of thing. It exists, but it is not a thing which can be understood using biological models.

2019-07-10 14:06:29 UTC  

It's like 'aggression'. You can model something like it using biology, but only a set kind of 'aggression'. One can be 'cruel to be kind' or even 'kind to be cruel', for example.

2019-07-10 14:07:04 UTC  

Such an emotion or way of thinking cannot be wholly fitted into a biological model because it's too vague and too flexible.

2019-07-10 14:07:55 UTC  

You might be able to model brute-force 'aggression', yes, but what about the purposes of this aggression, the uses of such aggression and so on?

2019-07-10 14:08:20 UTC  

What if the most aggressive thing to do is to *not* be 'aggressive' in the usual ways?

2019-07-10 14:09:51 UTC  

Concepts by themselves run away and explode into many things. We must consciously understand what they were like at different times, either in our thoughts, or in terms of concrete history, or both of these.

2019-07-10 14:10:50 UTC  

We can then split these concepts up and differentiate between them. That old 'aggression' is not the same as the new 'aggression', for example.

2019-07-10 14:12:01 UTC  

We already have concepts to describe these kinds of aggression, from passive-aggression to pacifism - but if we didn't have those, we would have no way of appreciating differences between the stages of things which change over time.

2019-07-10 14:12:49 UTC  

So we need to split these ideas open. It's like splitting 'fundamental' particles in a sense.

2019-07-10 14:13:40 UTC  

This is why I brought up the liar paradox.

2019-07-10 14:13:43 UTC  

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/360983468286410764/598517211807744000/unknown.png

2019-07-10 14:14:40 UTC  

The sentence 'this sentence is not true' contradicts itself and turns into something meaningless but only if we try to understand it as an unchanging thing.

2019-07-10 14:15:40 UTC  

**It is only absurd for those who have not yet grasped that the meaning of the sentence changes over time with each passing thought. When we look at how it contradicts itself, we find *two valid states* which, for a given moment, it can conform to: being true and being false.**

2019-07-10 14:18:05 UTC  

And there is also movement between being true and being false that we see in this picture.

2019-07-10 14:19:08 UTC  

This is closely linked to Hegel's dialectic: contradictory things are not just absurdities within a given system of thought, but they are things which necessitate a conscious division of the states between which they move - which implies that a new system of thought must be developed, often using pieces of the previous one.

2019-07-10 14:22:33 UTC  

**When applied to ourselves as people in general, it means that we cannot say that we are fundamentally determined by something which we can't ever be conscious of, because in our thoughts we can not only confront absurdities and meaningless things - dragging meaningful things out of them - but also, given the explosive paradox that I mentioned earlier, there's no way that we are static entities in any sense.**

2019-07-10 14:25:22 UTC  

***We cannot say that we are forever and causally determined by something that's outside of our sphere of reason and meaning - Marx's World of Man, Lacan's Symbolic Order - because then we can no longer say that we're casually determined by it since even if we came to know what truly determined us, we would already have understood it and we'd be beyond it control because we cannot fully understand ourselves at the present moment. __It becomes something which we just cannot control at that present moment.__***

2019-07-10 14:26:24 UTC  

So there is no responsibility upon anything else to do something about it or not. It is solely down to us.

2019-07-10 14:27:36 UTC  

It means that 'biology' is not an ultimate excuse to hide behind, since the only thing that stops us from modifying this is our present incompetence at changing it.

2019-07-10 14:28:28 UTC  

We do not have to have these bodies. Our subjectivities accelerate far beyond this, and they at least mostly can be preserved even if our biology is changed.

2019-07-10 14:29:21 UTC  

To say that we are essentially biological as subjects is not just to misrecognise ourselves, but to *insist* on a certain kind of misrecognition.

2019-07-10 14:30:32 UTC  

It is to ignore what we actually are as subjects: voids, *creative nothings* (to use Stirner's term), processes set in an ever-more diverse kind of motion.

2019-07-10 14:33:00 UTC  

This insisted misrecognition always leads to some kind of exclusionary politics - if people are fundamentally constituted by a combination of roles, for example, then *of course* it follows that to not follow that combination of roles would be to destroy people.

2019-07-10 14:34:11 UTC  

To uphold the existence of anyone who, by those standards, does not fulfil their personhood (i.e. how well they suit any of the roles in existence), would be to pour poison into the ocean of society according to such politics.

2019-07-10 14:36:38 UTC  

These standards built upon such insisted misrecognition are consciously conceived of by people in their thoughts and discourse to some degree or another. This is why there is a need to speak about 'liberty', 'purity' and all that shit in the first place and argue about it to convince people to do it on an intellectual, theoretical level.

2019-07-10 14:38:14 UTC  

It's never simply because of things like 'oh, they killed my brother' - it's about what that means and how people use such events to convince each other of the success of pursuing some political programme. This is not something which can be wholly understood using sociobiology, which at most can only target ranges of specific cases which are then generalised in theoretical models.

2019-07-10 14:41:41 UTC  

People fuck shit up not because it relates to something which forever floats out of their control, *but because of something which they cannot currently control at the most granular present moment*.