Message from @Cyborg
Discord ID: 598784408907939867
no, im insulting you
I literally never distanced from it. I still defend alot of Soviet aspects.
*But they weren't Socialists in the initial nature, which is what I am after*
Yes, because you can't argue
Of course the anarchist tard can only reduce to insults
Then debate finbol
Oh, you cant because you are literally to much of a coward to go on his server in VC and do so
```Since under capitalism wages are the price of labour-power```
https://www.marxists.org/subject/economy/authors/pe/pe-ch33.htm
They did their payments based upon the exchange values (see piece-rate system). Unironically the only difference is it's a fixed wage
```Oh, you cant because you are literally to much of a coward to go on his server in VC and do so```
So I can have 15 people yell at me for disagreeing?
What's the matter
can't argue for yourself?
>implying everyone is a debater
no, but you are obviously not going to debate someone who can debate you, because you'd be afraid of losing
yes Leah, because you don't have to be a debater to understand concepts.
Such as wage labor, or commodity-production
Finbol can hit me up anytime and if he presents something solid, he can have it. I don't care to be right. I care if I am not disproven and you're still claiming shit.
I debate people who CAN debate me every single day
Finbol is not some god
If you want, tell him I disagree. I'm not gonna go and vc and debate, sure. Purely because it's much easier to trip up, miss something.
I like my conversations to be *conclusive* and have everything needed to be said, said.
Then literally go in ULP and do so
Imaging wanting to preserve wage labor
@im in the middle of nowhere bruh Quick question vrovro
What’s goodie
If you are paying workers using a fixed rate based on the items exchange values, has wage labor changed to not be a wage anymore? Is the only thing that has changed simply the method of wage?
Also, I like how reading the comments of that video Finbol did, they think the people who do deny this idea are just doing it to disown the Soviets, PRC, etc
The reality is, if I think they were unironically using wage labor, and it contradicts principle, I am gonna say it
never once thought about trying to cope with the fact they collapsed
lmao
I would say yeah since payment should be a mixture of value of work/hours worked/ value of product but it would be far preferable than work based on hours
I've been there before. If I care to join, I will look it up again @Monolith But if you're so incessant on him debating me, he can talk to me.
```If you are paying workers using a fixed rate based on the items exchange values, has wage labor changed to not be a wage anymore?```
@im in the middle of nowhere bruh I am asking how this is not a wage
It still would be since by definition a wage is a fixed payment
Thanks
Glad I'm not trippin
Why did Leah say otherwise?
@im in the middle of nowhere bruh I don't truly know.
As far as I am aware, wage labor is a tenet socialism erases. Yet here they are with wages.
There is another argument I found saying *Socialism has a different wage type*
But it's still based on capital and exchange. it's just planned
so I am not seeing the difference here
Yeah I’ve always been under the assumption that socialists hated wages
I guess the hatred is market administered wages vs planned wages
sounds like exploitation to me
Eh