not being unable to see red

so assuming you wouldn't be able to tell by examining their eyes and they see a different red because of something neurological

how could you tell?

yeah, assuming that's all the same

imagine a clone of you in every physical way

who sees your "red" as your "blue" and vice versa

and understands everything in those terms

and in the situation where that isn't actually a phenomenon that could exist

hmm?

I didn't understand your last sentence

hang on i need to organise my thoughts, this is new territory for me

what were you saying about the clone

in my current understanding I would think that there would not be a situation where there was a physically identical clone to me that saw red and blue differently to me, after all we're physically identical

how can you say so

how would you be able to tell

what I was saying about the clone is imagine one, identical to you in every physical way, who in their subjective experience sees your "red and "blue" switched

nothing would change about the way they apparently perceive the world

after all, they still see both those wavelengths of light

while your red is his blue, you wont be able to tell the difference if you sit down and talk to him about it

or compare looking at pictures etc.

I worked my arms out yesterday and they don't feel sore, is it ok to work them out again today?

yeah I would agree that there would be no way of knowing that there is a difference, and other people might well perceive colours differently to me but they're also not physically identical to me

yeah

where is your "redness"

where does it exist?

is it a property one can deduce simply from examining your material composition

lets say one could do that perfectly

or rather, not just deduce

but is it something that reduces to it

bear in mind I am referring to your *subjective experience*

I would think that you could deduce that from my material composition, provided that i have a distinct memory of the colour red and that the memory must be encoded in my head somewhere

you could correlate it maybe

but it wouldn't tell you why you see whatever you see when you see red

why is your subjective experience what it is?

also, do you believe your cognition etc. is entirely reducible to material processes in general?

yeah I do, for some reason I just cant accept any other hypothesis just yet

there's not a fatal flaw i can see anywhere that couldn't just be attributed to the fact that humans as a whole really don't know shit about how the brain works

isn't there a fatal flaw in that it is deterministic?

it's deterministic yeah

so people dont really think, in a meaningful way?

things just happen, by predictable processes