Message from @Beemann
Discord ID: 512707618318450708
So life can't be a right because if someone kills you, you can't sue them :^)
Invariably all Rights could be taken away, quite easily.
They must be able to own property think which speech is a extension of this pursue happiness life liberty
These are all requirements of humans survival
Individual, exclusive property is not a survival requirement. Groups have owned property for ages
Sure but people who havent produced relied on the other man who did
Or thought
One can find a cave based on percepts but to build shelter he must think
The people who unfocus their mind and dont think or produce are subhuman to add to that to produce one must be able to think
You don't require all that much beyond the basics to survive though. That's why many traditions last as long as they do- there's no need to change them. It wasn't necessarily to build a car, for instance, even though the impact of automobiles has been massive
@Beemann Except it improved the quality of life
Which we need to survive
Ultimately though rights must be restrictions placed on the larger social order for the sale of the individual
You don't need cars to survive
Well its more complicated
Either way it improves the quality of life
Sure, I'm just pointing out the difference between "necessary to survive" and "an improvement"
I would argue that personal, exclusive property is good, but it isn't necessary for survival
Trace back to the fundamentals and its more than just food water and shelter
Man must produce to survive autmobiles help him with this and provide better quality of life overall
"Must"
No, not really
Man desires a better quality of living and so he strives
Even a subhuman man will die from him being led by to his own destruction by another man or him taking his life
@Beemann Would you say happiness is essential to life?
Hell, there are even maladaptive inventions
I would say satisfaction is essential
If you trace it back mans satisfaction comes from production
What is produced when a man climbs a mountain?
Even just basic survival
That feeling of adrenaline cant be maintained
The feeling of adrenaline isn't the only reward
Stuff like that is more complex knowledge because alot goes on
Maybe just achieving a goal is all it is but can it be consistent?
And yet it produces satisfaction, to the point where there are people who work only to fund expeditions
I dont know
But the person also to add had to use tools in most cases man created
This is, FYI, why people echo "life is suffering"
In what way?
Because it is in striving and overcoming that people find satisfaction
Whether by creation, conquest etc