Hi.

Doing alright @Nepene

Yes. Very hard to talk about men's rights with anyone in real life because of where I live and work.

Hi

It's the only sensible way to use the term

Welcome @Garrison

Is that why you're here?

@Nepene can add you to channels

lolo is clearly a racist child. You have to be one to be antideutsche. It's embedded in both the theory and the praxis.

Also ancaps are as hilarious as Maoists. Just a friendly but entirely deserved drive by.

Okay that's just a grotesque overcorrection of reality.

Nobody gives a shit? True. Everyone is barely scraping by? Lol.

Really depends on way too many things.

Oh okay. Ceiling is much lower. No argument.

That's not what I was objecting to. Was just reminding not to get melodramatic. Wartime conditions aren't normal even in communist countries. Not all of them were particularly awful materially.

Like make your arguments but no need to get out there ridiculous.

Or you can leave your job and go work literally wherever else if qualified.

Which was the actual reality. Because there were plenty of shit jobs to do.

You didn't sell your work to the government. You sold it to your factory or your hospital or your regional planner.

On a down at the ground level that's how it worked.

The institutions even competed with each other. Some jobs were nicer than others. Some unions were better than others.

People poached workers from each other. Seriously man. I don't know where you're getting all this.

The ceiling is higher under capitalism.

Not my point Indigo.

The wall of text was that everyone was starving and only motivated to work by the threat of prison. Which is divorced from reality.

Unions could offer different bonuses and premium pay.

It's not a direct comparison between a hypothetical capitalist alt USSR where everything went great and historical USSR. It's just a reminder that life wasn't some caricature and you can point out the faults of the system without resorting to fiction.

Being free to starve isn't freedom. But this is probably irreconcilable positions between us.

Most capitalist-bound countries are closer to starving than to USA standards.

Starvation is normal in CAR.

You don't get to disavow capitalist developing states.

Every African bunghole is capitalist today.

That's the only one and it's shit.

Also Maoist.

There were more but USSR went bankrupt and couldn't pay them no more.

Lol no you don't get to day that.

Nobody gets to be reeling from socialism any more than one gets to reel from evil whitey colonizer.

Apparently the reeling is so stronk you can be reeling for decades.

Close to a century in some cases.

Yes. There are success stories.

Not arguing the general idea.

When?

....so what happened since then?

Okay this is just excuses and special pleading.

Successful countries are rare. Successful countries can build successful capitalisms.

50 years of capitalism being unable to unfuck 6 years of thirdworldist maybe socialism isn't a great record.

This is just notruefeminism

Were. Before you were born.

Own the failures and allow some nuance ffs. You might even be right overall.

Own Cameroon.

Own Comoros.

Ancaps lol.

Please explain relevance.

I am not blaming colonialism for present day problems

Yeah both are just as dumb an excuse.

Was my point.

Almost everyone is doing better now. But the crises of the transitions must belong to the new system.

Armed revolutions are the worst way to do it course.

Yes and that's also capitalist.

This digressed magnificently.

Sure. No point going in circles. My only intent was to represent things closer to how they were than to the idealised vision of how it must have been.

People went to work. People worked. Stuff was produced and consumed.

Okay if you restrict capitalism to only mean functional countries then only functional countries will be capitalist. That's a tautology.

Okay so? Guys come on. This conversation started as a very narrow comment about an exaggeration that detracted from taking the overall point seriously.

You're not owning it though.

Ok fine.

Not what I'm here for. Do you have the ability to move this whole thing to another channel? Cause we are still in welcome.

What are your interests, cat?

hello!

men must absolutely organise and to disdain the experience of other groups that won things by organising is foolish

i think this is a long road. men need to re-assert themselves in child-rearing, parental rights and education at all levels

and thereafter once again in law and letters and academia. what the feminists did, basically.

The bigger fools are the guys who keep marrying those same women even knowing their past behaviour.

"Happened to Johnny but I'm twice the man he is, can't happen to me." 3 years later: "How could this happen to me??"

Hello!

I'm sure the people conflating the concepts know exactly what they're doing.

Yeah. Not saying it's everyone, but there's a core group in the know and in power. It's not a conspiracy either, just self-interest.

hello. welcome.

Hi

They are. A mod should welcome you shortly.

Would a robot ever say that

A mod can invite you in shortly @Rowan's Fuxedo

Hi. What brings you here?

Hi.. What are your concerns?

what brings you to the server?

I guess the mods are sleeping right now

Hey!

then welcome

Hello :)