*again*

This might be the 3rd time i join lol

How’s everyone doing?

Nice. Nice.

I’m good too

Is it bad that I’m disappointed it didn’t happen

Because I low key am

What makes capitalists primitive?

@Azaz3l

Russian leaders?

You don’t think Russian capitalists invest in industry when it’s industry that makes them the profit?

Ha, Russia never learns lol

But like I say many times. There is no universal system for anything

Well, seeing how those people were taught that’s how capitalism works, you can’t really place the whole blame on them

Doesn’t mean they’re not guilty of anything, but they don’t get all the blame

Lol

🇺🇸 🇺🇸 🇺🇸

It’s also a declaration of war on a strategic ally of the western powers

Aka...

Not a smart thing to do

As a Cuban, im proud to say... **Fuck Castro and fuck communism.**

It ruined my homeland

*both Castros

Transgender 4 year olds are the same as vegan cats. We all know who is making the lifestyle choices.

- The only reason the school system is that well is because they literally abuse the children. I have cousins that literally get beaten by teachers and administrators for failing tests.
- Universal healthcare? Boi I have actually been to a hospital in Cuba. Not the pretty one in Havana that they send tourists and the press to, no I went to the one that my actual family goes to. A hospital in central Cuba where the actual Cuban people go. It is an absolute disaster. A train wreck. It is as if they never even heard of hand sanitizer. It was hot and humid and you could see mold on the roof.
- Income??? **Income?** *Income ROSE?* what fantasy are you looking at? Everyone in Cuba, and I mean every who isn’t a Castro or their friends, is dirt poor. Why do you think they never go on vacations anywhere? The live in shacks and tiny cramped public housing. They have no wealth. Nobody has wealth. They barely have enough for food. That’s why me and my family have to send our family that’s imprisoned on the island money to buy basic necessities for a decent lining standard. I went there just last year and they were completely mystified by a VHR. What kind of wealth is in Cuba outside of the Castro residence?
- there is no excess of poverty because everyone is in poverty. To them, poverty is seen as normal and average.

So yea

It’s a complete and utter shithole

The rusting cruise ship port in Havana is a testament to the reason why Communism destroyed an island that had so much potential.

I want to see you try and convince me, that what I saw with my own 2 eyes was not a shithole

@The Fourth International#8084

Why can’t I ping

**Tell me...
- How do you justify the literal child abuse going on in government schools for children who fail to accomplish assignments properly?
- how do you consider a “hospital” or “clinic” that resembles a hospital out of a zombie apocalypse movie, to be** *”primary healthcare”?*
**- how do you explain a raise in income when literally everyone except for like 50 people on the island is living in dirt poor poverty standards.**

The only reason they say their care is *primary* is because its all so much crap that they can call it primary and they cant say its wrong because that shitty hole of “medicine” truly is the best medical service they can find

Not to mention the horrendous human rights violations they have in Cuba that they are infamously known for? Oh yes, their prison and system of “justice”

My uncle got a front row seat for that “utopian justice system”

By getting 15 years of hard labor, and having his wife and kids harassed by the police themselves. They rather call other criminals to protect them from crime than call the police.

He was release and managed to escape the prison island and is now peacefully living in Hialeah, Florida

What was the crime he did you may ask? Robbery? Rape? Rioting? None of the above. He was saying how he didnt like communism or how Castro was running the island. That is literally it

If **anyone** can defend the “glorious” communist prison of Castro’s Cuba... please... do not hesitate

Rant over.

^^^

@Deleted User the fact you automatically jumped to sexual intentions and imagery seems like an issue that i hope you resolve

This is why we need a reset button for humanity

Wow. Judgemental much?

Why can i not ping people?

Why

*puts commie hat on*

Okay master

I will never question your ultimate authority

I live in the US but i have family in Cuba. I have visited them and seen your “glorious” communist haven

And we can talk about Guantanamo Bay another day because frankly, what the US does there does not affect how Cuba treats its people

Nice a picture. Lets take it apart and inject some hard truths. just for the sake of arguments, i will even pretend that they dont modify numbers to make things seem better than they are because you’d have to be a complete moron to think they dont change numbers. Every tyrannical dictatorship changes statistical numbers to make is seem like their people are happy and healthy under their rule.
- Education related squares - they refuse to address the terrible child abuse employed by the government to achieve such statistics. The school system in Cuba isnt even that great. They learn to read and write but thats it. When cubans come to the United States with a degree in literally anything, it is equated to a high school diploma because of how low the education is. Very rarely does it equate to an American equivalent to an AA degree. Therefore it is much more easier to fund free education because the education is shit.
- Gender Equality squares - this has nothing to do with communism. Unless i missed a chapter of something. An economic system is not more gender accepting than other economic systems. That is purely social and cultural decisions that have very little if anything to do with economics. At the very least, they fact that so many men are being sent to prison camps for voicing discontent will open the door for more women to take their roles in society. And thats a bit *if*.
- The health squares - the majority of these vaccines came with massive support from China and the former Soviet Union. And just because they participate in foreign aid missions doesn’t mean they are the ones who led or had a crucial role in that effort. They could literally send one person and they will be counted as assisting the cause. Just like many other nations do. Norway and Sweden sent i think a total of 10 people (max) to help the US in their wars of the Middle East and yet they are considered to be as participating in these actions.

- Living standards - this is literally laughable. In every essence. The low unemployment rate (if its true) could only be achieved by people being forced to take jobs that they don’t want. It also limits the possibilities for innovation because as more technology emerges, people loose their jobs to that technology which would cause unemployment to rise. This is a major role as to why there is extremely low development on the island even though they are close allies of China. This also fails to even address the horrific poverty that has fallen onto the island even thought they have been aided by the Soviet Union, Venezuela, and China.

And if you want to debate the military actions of the US in Syria, we can. But once again. That has absolutely nothing to do with Cuba’s horrific human rights violations due to communism and tyrannical dictatorship.

I respect the fact you are honest

Most would just make up some BS

Well.... Me, my cuban family, cuban friends, basically the entire cuban american community in the city of Miami, and even my family in Cuba all firmly agree it is communism. Even the people who support the regime in Cuba (due to brainwashing by the government) agree it is communism

You’re possibly the first person i encounter to even see it as not a communist nation

And that was after you defended Cuba as being a communist nation

Wait wait wait.... what?

You literally just tried to convince me that Cuba provided healthcare and education systems that you also claimed was of good quality. Now you’re saying they don’t provide that.... what exactly is your view on it? Do they provide basic needs or not?

(I love how you deleted your former comment that started this whole thing. Good thing i took a screenshot of is)

You also said there was “no excess of poverty or opulence” which is equal to social class disparity. Once again... which one is it? Do they have social class disparity or not?

Screenshot for reference

You are defending their communist government, communist practices, communist “achievements”, and you were responding to my direct attacks against the Communist leader and its communist government.

Just using basic critical thinking will allow anyone to see that you were defending them as a communist nation.

You even made an attack against capitalism which only reinforces the inference that you were arguing this on the basis of communism and its functionality because you tried to bring a comparison between capitalism. A very strange attack if i may add which had no real value to the arguments.

Right.

Are you gonna go with that one

You sure

I seemed to have attempted to ping the right person

Definitely the same person

Hmm. Strange is it not?

Why can’t I ping people?
<@&309314344158494720>

@The Fourth International#8084

@killsometime#2709

@TubeYou#6442

It seems to be this server only

What exactly is libertarian communism?
Libertarianism believes that government should be minimal and should hardly if ever intrude on the rights and liberties of people.
Communism believes in the government stealing from the rich, to give it to people who didn’t deserve it. All while oppressing their people to eliminate freedom of thought and innovation to ensure the longevity of the communist regime. Nearly all communist nations are extremely against libertarian ideals

So again. What exactly is “libertarian communism”?

Give me one communist nation in the history of the world that does not require massive government to oppress and impoverish its people.

Give me one nation that calls itself communism that doesn’t have oppressive regimes and massive human rights violation.

And while you’re at it, please tell me how you plan to rob all the money and assets people have and distribute it among people who did nothing to deserve it (while killing anyone that questions or threatens the regime) without getting some form of government involved.

Ah yes. The pinnacle of high living standards. I remember my vacation to Burkina Faso. It was so lovely. The schools and healthcare are truly world class. The nations of the first world should really take notes so they can have systems that resembles them.

I said name nations. Not regions within a nation that have absolutely nothing to show for anything.... Unless you consider endless warfare a good thing to show off.

And are you really Using North Korea? Seriously? To prove that communist nations **DON’T** have oppressive regimes that impoverish their people and kill anyone that dares to speak up against them?

I honestly don’t know anything about the topic of “Shinmin” so I don’t feel it is correct for me to argue for or against anything I don’t know

Ehh, imo, anarchism can work... but not for advanced societies

It’s for more rural communities

(Sorry for that typo there)

There is no economy system that is perfect for everyone in every corner of the world.

Capitalism doesn’t work for everyone, I will very easily concede that

Wanting anarchism and having anarchism are 2 very different things.

Well seeing how the economy of the Ukraine today was created mostly out of expansion of western business practices (capitalism) after the Iron Curtain fell, it would probably see a huge economic loss if it fully reverted to communism. Take for example if the state of California became a fully communist state (ignoring all the civil rights it would have to break to achieve that). The rest of the US would still be around to support the state and their massive social welfare programs. Having just one region fully communist while having the rest of the nation foot the bill, isn’t really a good way to support a theory

But let me ask you this...

Why are you in favor of stealing from people? Communism preaches taking the wealth of wealthy people and giving it to people who didn’t deserve it. For the sake of equality and fairness. That is called stealing. You will have to rob and kill to get that from people and I wanna know... why do you support that?

Well if you’re not going to answer my question... thats fine... but please explain to me how capitalism is seen as stealing when then the basis of its working is when 2 **consenting** individuals agree on a trade of goods/services/labor.

A businessman/woman makes a profit by selling goods and services that people want or need. Phones, hair cuts, car washes, massages. They then hire people to help them sell these things or make them. They come to an agreement. Person X hires person Y and pays them Z amount per hour or by wage. It is a consenting agreement. There is nobody forcing person person Y to work for person X or they will be executed.

Th value is not made by the owner. Value is created by the free market. If a business owner sells a banana for $100 because he thinks they are valued that much, how many bananas do you think he will sell? None. Because society does not value a banana to be worth $100. The reason Apple can sell iPhones for hundreds of dollars, is because the free markets agree that iPhones have that much value. Steve Jobs didn’t sit at his desk and say that in iPhone will cost $600 because he said so.

The profit made by the business is then owned by the business. They use that money for paying staff, buying new inventory, making products, maintaining facilities, donating to other organizations that promote their ideals, and saving some for rainy days down the line.

If the workers want more money, they can organize strikes and demand higher pay like they did in the US before. Thats is why we have trade and labor unions. There are things they can do to have higher pay that doesnt include reverting to communism. But even then, there is a limit to this. A person flipping burgers at a McDonald’s is not doing the labor that the majority of society sees as necessary for $15 per hour.

There is not a single person dictating to everyone how things are, who gets money, or how much things cost. It is determined by the free market and general public.

Now... i explained why Capitalism is not considered stealing from people. Can you please answer my question.

**Why are you in favor of stealing from people? Communism preaches taking the wealth of wealthy people and giving it to people who didn’t deserve it. For the sake of equality and fairness. That is called stealing. You will have to rob and kill to get that from people and I wanna know... why do you support that?**

**MY EYES**

Lol

@When Things Aren't Right Go Left ^^^

Are you forced to work for someone?

Does someone point a gun at you and say “work”?