wow no one in vc?
this server sucks...

fuck haven't configured the mic in this ubuntu yet
-_-

linux is gay confirmed

a trans that likes to trans trans

???
pretty simple to understand

the cock and the puss

yeah that's gay bro

Hey there

libtards btfo they will never recover

btw I'm actually an ancap.

I came here cause I can't be in right-wing discords cause that's basically illegal in my country.
this is what you get from laws like that.
ancaps in your server.

@smiley boy
do you have xx or xy chromossomes?

answer the question directly please.

xx or xy?

🤦

mhmmm sure buddy

So are people here actually left wing in any sense?

ur just a white cock lover I see.
so a literal white supremacist smh.

yeah that's literal white supremacy

it's a fucking lefty discord server and people are like this
wow

no you can't cause that's literally AN fascist.

This says a lot about our white-supremacist society.

no

no your server is probably just a bunch of trap porn

you fucking hethen

I'm gonna try and find another leftypol server lol

SurfaceCombatant I'm guessing you're 12 or some shit

stop..

@ᵈˢʳ✪
tell me about your economic beliefs.

I'm curious

no fucking clue what either of those are.

expose it your own terms pls

holy fuck peterson was such a cuck in the debate
literally shaking and shit

sad!

Jordan peterson really tore the communist manifesto a whole new asshole though.

was actually surprised at that.
I thought he was gonna be more retarded

sorry sweetie but he did.

Mékié gente?

são mesmo de esquerda aqui?

Who wrote he communist manifesto?
It wasn't fucking lenin

well when he was shitting on the manifestothat wasn't " critiquing Leninism" you liberal

it's a joke.

What exactly about his crituique of the communist manifesto was wrong?
You are saying "he thinks it's leninism" but that doesn't really tackle anything he said

yes

address the fucking arguments he gave specifically.
you are wandering in these fucking categorizations and complaining he doesn't know about the specific strands and shit. not tackling the actual arguments.
he said giving a shit ton of power to people in the designed system would corrupt them and lead them to do things that ironically commies complain about capitalists doing.
And that's incredibly accurate because it did in fact happen in the USSR.

that is a very legitimate and accurate critique

oh it wasn't a socialist revolution? ok retard.

ok so you're saying that the structure of the ussr doesn't count as worker ownership

it's just a state ownership

Well if I were you I would rethink the whole process of which you usually start these revolutions because that 's what happened every single fucking time. except in catalunha and shit
but those anarchist ones got fucked really, really fast by surrounding nationalist countries

>Many nations moved down the socialist path from ww2
Like what?

In what way were those actually controlled by workers?
Albania for example was authoritarian as fuck.

@ᵈˢʳ✪
yes it's more a critique of authoritarianism.
hmm I didn't know that about yugoslavia. thought it was just like the ussr lmao

Anyway.
Didn't yugoslavia end up implementing censorship and a police state, and torture and all that anyway?

I know albania did.

Ok and you don't think that this despot arouse me because there was a system in place that was prone to that?

I bet they had some sort of powerful central organ that was just waiting to be grabbed.
I mean here you are telling me they had lots of ellections and shit
and then you talk about individual leaders and "he fucked it all up."
it sounds like there was obviosuly a minority of people controlling shit from the top down in a centralized economy

Well I'm sorry but just having ellections for these people to rule from the top down doesn't count as "worker control" for me.
The workers literally threw their control into the hands of one fucking guy. Which is precisely prone to the problems JBP was talking about

Ok fuck this I should just study the history of those countries better than asking this shit here.
But the fact that they ended up having censorship and torture and shit, that's very suspicious. That's a fucking dictatorship. council or not.

Seriously. If they started with free elections and ended up there, something was wrong with the system to begin with.
and if you guys want to do your shit you're gonna have to fix that

We're not criticizing socialism.
We're just criticizing the systems that all attempted to achieve socialism.
mhmm ok

"didn't work" is too vague dude

@ᵈˢʳ✪
Ok so what else is socialism in your view?
The socialist party is the leading party in my country right now.
Plus they're in a coalition with "the communist party" and "the left block"
is my country socialist?

@ᵈˢʳ✪
In what sentence of mine did you aprehend that I was conflicting ML with all of socialism?
I explicitely mention anarchist systems like Catalunha as socialist...

@Deleted User
I'm sorry but these system were a lot closer to "worker control of the means of production" than any others

@ᵈˢʳ✪
I didn't exactly said "it failed". I said it lead to authoritarian, top-down regimes. Did they not?
I mean, the anarchists didn't...

@Deleted User
ok so what was Catalunha then? fucking communism? did the spaniards do it?

I feel both of you spend way to much time arguing and talking about the labels of shit than addressing the problems of the organization of power and shit. jesus

it's like you're talking about fucking pokemon or something

it was [esoteric commie label] not [label given by me].

this is unnecessary and not productive

well I spent like 10+ hours reading the fucking anarchist faq so I'm guessing yes.

but again, WHY THE FUCK DO YOU CARE SO MUCH ABOUT THE LABELS?
why don't you just argue for the system?

fuck

when the fuck did I use the ‘but that was real socialism’?
these whole fucking thing has been me trying to figure out what you think is socialism.

Ok so let's try to take things from the top here.
USSR is not socialism. correct?

Ok so that I understood.
Now, yugoslavia started as socialism, but degenerated into authoritarianism. Correct?

Ok so if you have markets, but worker ownership of the MoP. Is that socialism?

fuck this is boring.

@ᵈˢʳ✪
So I have a bunch of enterprises competing in a maket with each other.
But they're each run by meetings with all the workers.
Is that socialism?

@Deleted User
No I'm just trying to understand what the fuck you consider socialism.
It's a fucking problem I have EVERY TIME I argue with socialists.
I've had some tell me "Of course the USSR was socialism. What the heck."
Others don't.
Some think NK is. Others don't.
And I have to go through this fucking process every time. it's so fucked.

It's a problem not only for me you know.
this fucking thing happens a lot in left/right debates. Well, economic left/right debates at least.

>there’s more infighting on the left than debate with the right
I see this on the right a lot as well.
I can't say it's more than the time we spend arguing with the left but I don't think socialists have an ideia of how much infighting goes on.
you have ancaps vs state capitalists vs fascists vs nazis
And then fascists have mussolini vs salazar
And then ancaps have their own shit
and then they start trying to decide if race-mixing is wrong or not
and then they start trying to decide if christianism is jewish or not
and it's so fucking fucked.

Wether the holocaust happened or not...
Wether women should vote or not...
Wether Islam is based or not...
etc etc

I din't think you did.

@Deleted User
yes I know hitler liked Islam that's one of the reasons the debate comes up.

@Deleted User
you'd be surprised as to how many nazis actually like it

you see christianism is resented because it ended up being used to promote multiculturalism and even feminism and left leaning political measures.

@ᵈˢʳ✪
The problem Hitler had with Christianity was more about how it was less agressive than other religions, than it being jewish. He prefered Islam and Zen Buddhism because they were more given to violence and "hyper masculinity" let's call it.

He also liked the way Islam controlls women

Yes and the thing about women and the right.
Is that some stats seem to sugest that women are more left-leaning then men.
Women seem to be more prone to promoting collective ownership

there's also that "men with higher blood testosterone are more likely to be right wing" but I'm skeptical of that.
I mean you have stalinists and shit. That doesn't seem very low-test to me...

Well the thing about Stalin

Was that wether or not you believe he was right or wrong, the man was very much able to leave a big fucking impact in the world, and make a name for himself

And that, in itself, is admirable. Of course I hate the fucker.
But it seems that often times things that are more attractive, are the ones that are more flashy and intense, rather than the ones that are right.

Like seriously I'm an ancap but in many ways I'm jealous of Stalin
He robbed banks, and climbed to the top of the party, and saw a revolution, saw a huge war and played a part in it. I wish my life was that exciting

>In a fucked up way I think nobody could have done a better job
Yes, in a very fucked up way that is true.
That MASSIVE boost in productivity would not have come if not for all that literal slavery.
In fact, if I'm not mistaken, the USSR's economy started to stagnhate after that, partly because of this.

Yeah the military budget was too big, no?
that's my view at least, the USSR's econmy was stagnant cause they needed to invest a lot in the military, cause the US was constantly on their ass

Yeah dealing with the US has been a huge problem for many of these regimes.
Can't say I'm sad about that though. lmao
Partly I am though, I fucking hate the US in it's current state.

You know, you should be careful with US elections
In fact, I think you shouldn't vote at all.
We all thought Trump was gonna be good for us but he turned out to be a total fucking traitor.
No wall, no repealing obamacare, more Israel support, literally increased immigration, etc, etc