And while we're talking about the people that helped build amazon let's talk about the horrendous working conditions in amazon fulfillment warehouses

I'm in!

agreed, we should raise working conditions for laborers in those positions

Nein. Thanks to greedy corporations, I can't afford to do so.

I mean, I'm being for real

Duly rewarded

Right.

and then accept the steeper costs associated for those better working conditions in Amazon centers

I can technically become a citizen of a certain country

That's why Amazon employees have some of the worst working conditions every right?

>taking a shit job with shitty pay and shitty conditions in communist e Asia

they (mostly) don't invest in the company

Jeezus the level of autism is staunch

Jeezus the level of autism is staunch

do you understand that it's just as absurd from my perspective???

because we have totally different paradigms on this

Because there's no pay out in investing at the level most employees have? Because most of them are barely breaking even as it is?

well they also didn't invest early enough

returns would have been higher if they had

Why would I, your average American, spend money on an intangible item that may or may not maintain its value rather than something I need

Good god that's retarded.

Consumerism

That's why

because that's how you accumulate wealth LOL

their money would be worth x1794 what it was at IPO if they had invested THEN

even MORE if they had before ipo

Riiiiiiight. I'm sure that's comforting to people like Konot and I that dont have that ability

What do you define as investing in the company? Because I think the true definition of investing in a company is the work you put into it. Your sweat, blood, and tears. I own stocks in gold mines but I don't consider myself to have "invested" in those mines because I don't work the mines

Personal opinion here but wealth shouldn't be measured by monetary gain

yes you do, that's what IPO is

Thinking like that is why the poor stay poor and the rich stay rich

Should be based on land, and the things you have

Technically it is

man we should have a debate channel

@Hellhound6 we had that kind of wealth system at one point

@AKAlexei I think that's a semantics argument, I consider investing as giving money to the company through stock or % ownership

I kn9w

@CatLoverKid agreed

Semantics

Autism

Basically "if you cant afford to invest it sucks to be you stay poor"

I see we are having an in depth discussion on economics

@Foxhound do you have more than $1 in your bank?

why don't you invest it?

get a robinhood

do research into emerging companies, and invest in them

I mean invest in certain guns and armor

Just sayib

oof

feel free to do that, but be careful lol

You were saying?

Like stocks

LOL

damn son

But what should take place instead is that people need to start finding ways to create worker owned businesses with councils that help to ensure that the employees actually control their working environments. Bureaucracy and some "hierarchy" is necessary due to specialization (like if there's one dude who knows about company insurance policies he should be the one to tend to that), but for the most part, people should have control over their workplace. I don't believe in seizing the means because it historically fails, but I do believe it needs to grow organically

nothing stops you from doing that right now you know

excuse me, very little does

Lack of capital, lack of production line, and more than likely, regulation

that's a very good point

so the issue is: How do you raise capital for a corp?

production line comes from capital

regulation can come from within the company

oops, typo fixed

Not everyone can afford to invest you fucking autist. This is literally what makes people *Hate* the system you seem to support because they cannot get ahead. Konot is losing his home and risking life and limb. I'm losing my home and scrambling to find one. How dare you sit there and say "Have you not a dollar? Why, you should invest it!" That's retarded. Given the choice between a stock that might pay out or might fail altogether against actually being able to eat and afford my needs? I'll chose the latter thank you. Put your faith in banks and stocks. If financial collapse hits, itll be the poor coming after your blood and after the blood of those that betrayed our very life for the Almighty Dollar.

I should've been clearer in my statement. Regulation as in government regulation; I don't know for certain, but I'm almost positive that there are government regulations in place that make it difficult for a truly workers run business to come to fruition

Also, Deaths Head, just to be clear since I know I haven't updated people much? But it's no longer a losing my home situation. I HAVE lost my home

Just wanted to be clear

I think that so long as everyone is on the ownership contract, it works out. Granted, the contract/legality isn't gonna be easy

That simply strengthens my point.

wait you guys owned homes?

I rented with my mom... and now I can't do that anymore. Trying to live with her means costs go up and we can't afford food

Same here.

no apartments?

and you don't wanna move?

There are none we can afford.

no roommate options?

Even with room mates the costs are still too high

^

I'm very skeptical of that :/

I can't speak for @Foxhound but around here, you need at least 90k a year AFTER taxes just to survive

that's pretty expensive, is there literally NOWHERE you can go?

no friends, contacts?

you're not applying to other jobs elsewhere?

Yeah. There is somewhere I can go... Parris Island, SC

Same here.

oh hey I worked there lol

that's funny

You were a Marine?

well if you like the risk associated with it, then go for it

no, installed a backup battery for the base

My mother can't afford a house unless I'm with her. And combined our income is over 60k at least.

@CatLoverKid you don't understand. It's the only choice I have left.

If I don't, that's it. No opportunities elsewhere are left

have you been applying to jobs the entire time that are in areas you can afford?

there are ALWAYS opportunities

Yep

And no

There aren't always opportunities

There are NOT always opportunities you autist