So if a person enters into a disbelieving government, and he genuinely tries to rule by the shariah in what he can, this person isn't a kafir

Hasn't Erdogan said before tho that he doesn't want an Islamic State

I'm not sure if he's used those exact words, but he's certainly called to secularism many times

Had Erdogan not explicitly called to secularism I wouldn't make takfeer on him

Yeah, I get not being able to fully implement shariah but actively promoting secularism sounds like kufr to me

There may be other kufr Erdogan is guilty of, but that is the only one I know for sure that I can pin him on

There's also the fact that he seems to betray the Mujahideen in Syria

@Jacob 🕋 well, if he doesn't say it then he would be removed from power. A leader has to do it, it is illegal for politicians to say that they want sharia.

But that's not kufr afaik

@Jacob 🕋 yes he seems to betray the mujahedeen. That seems to be the worst to me.

Would it really get him removed tho? I mean, after that coup a couple years ago I imagine he has quite a bit of power

when you're on TV in Egypt and you say "Muslims shouldn't be afraid of secularism" or willingly say something like "secularism means the government having equal distance from all religions, this is what we want", I can't really excuse that. If he just sheepishly one time answered a tv interview with something like 'Turkey is a secular state by it's constitution and I will uphold that' that I can excuse.

@Jacob 🕋 yes it would, because it is the law. He would have to change the constitution due to the obvious kaffir ataturk who made such a degeneracy.

Yes but it's not illegal to call for a reform in the Turkish constitution tho is it?

@...new if what you say is true then sure, I haven't really followed it that closely.

I mean maybe it's the American in me but I'd imagine constitutions change quite often in the grand scheme of things

@Jacob 🕋 if it is a reform towards a more religious government, yes it is.

Interesting

Anyone who is religious need to be very careful with their words. There have been tons of coups because people want atheist rule.

>there are people in turkey who want homosexual rule

Erdogan needs to hire some assassins and do a purge

I've certainly never pulled off a coup before but I imagine if you can win over a couple generals it isn't the hardest thing in the world

he did survive a coup

I'm not knowledgeable enough on the situation in Turkey to say for sure but I feel like if he really wanted to establish the shariah in Turkey he could be doing a bit more than he currently is

@Jacob 🕋 he probably could. May Allah guide the Turkish people and government and remove the atheist state.

آمين

ameen

inshallah turkey will be disbanded and replaced with a Sultanate

Turkey will be replaced by a Caliphate.

InshaAllah.

KARA BOGA Osmanli Imparatorlugu

Based https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna906051

KEK

but seriously he shouldnt have done that maybe they could have changed their minds later in their lives now they are gonna hate islam even more

I don't know what they said though. God guides who he wants, just because they are ignorant it is not a blank cheque to say anything they want. The brother will be judged according to his intentions on judgement day, but violence does make it less likely that kuffar talks shit. Look at how the Muhammad caricature competition was cancelled. Would not be done without it.

The brother sacrificed himself so that the rest of us will be less likely to deal with this. If this always happened then none of the kuffar would dare. They are not muslims, they are afraid of death.

True you are right there should be respect the muslim should be proud in front of the kuffar and softwith other believers

And even if a Muslim makes a mistake we ought to assume it was meant in the best way possible. May Allah bless him and make things easy for him and grant him access to Jannah Al Firdaws. Ameen.

amen

Israel made ISIS to make the non muslims hate us, think we're all terrorists, think we hate non muslims, think we hate gays, think we oppress women etc when this is not true. I'm a Muslim and proud American and Islam is a religion of peace, Isis don't represent me. All my best friends are non Muslims, Isis are just extremists who misunderstand the religion, unlike me, I never pray or fast or anything but I understand the true Islam. It makes me cry when non Muslims think I'm a terrorist. I wish non Muslims would like me so much, please like me white people please