Message from @Seven Of Swords
Discord ID: 487398752186007572
The computer programmer would take the computer that he already bought in the previous system, and create new data structures to use that don't rely upon IP rights or having to program as the sole driver of their ability to sell their labor.
No one would be imposing anything on anyone lol
People that are frustrated with the way things are in this society would "leave". These "Leavers" would come from all aspects of life. Computer Programmer, engineers, farmers etc.
You can find many people from those groups which could come together and produce a new means of social relations.
The people that would make up these communities would be disgusted by the idea of needing to sell anyone's labor power for survival.
okay, so let me pose an example: I as a mechanical engineer, would have to provide your community, because your community says so. another community would not need me to provide that amount of work for them, to get more food/shelter/whatever. I go there, you will only get mechanical engineers on a lower level to provide for your community, ending up on a lower quality of engines and stability on the long run. and the you would say I guess, that's not fair
1) Its not simply because the community says so, it would be because he would want to.
If he didn't want to then he could go somewhere else where he would want a profit for selling his labor power.
oh, then let me pose a more radical example:
Scenario 1: vicious people come to your community and slaughter the men/rape the women. since you hate the idea of violence
Scenario 2: certain people of your community will say, they will fight for your community, for being treated better and having to work less for their survival
Meh. Every community has that problem. In my opinion, if that is your criterion for as to why my theory won't work, then you should be consistent and apply it to capitalism as well. People get raped all of the time in capitalism, hell police officers do that to people and can get away with it in some instances lol. If your problem is "oh, but your little shitty hippie society won't have guns and will be raped by people that do" well guess what? If it is the case that we shouldn't have some societies over other because of that problem, yet no society has ever not had rapists, then we should just get rid of society entirely via a human extinction plague akin to the Krogan genophage from Mass Effect.
High Roller. Either we make the best damn society free of problems, or we shouldn't have one at all. Simple.
And keep in mind, brutal violence doesn't have to be the only problem, it could be any problem really.
wow man, you failed to provide any arguments again. we're not talking about the current society now, you deflected my points totally. we were on the theoretical level, where I was trying to get the argument on why that happy-go-lucky society of your would be able to survive without people wanting to trade
I find that the distinction between theory and praxis is blurred.
I never said this society in which we're living in is perfect, all I'm saying is, economically the free market is the least shitty solution. times may come where it can/will be improved, but right now it's what we have to go with.
In my example, its not a strict abstraction. It would still have to deal with the transition from capitalism to a post-capitalist system all the while the people are still in transition.
also, minarchism is the way to go, nudge-nudge
No lol
People can do much better than a shitty free market lol
wow, and now you're talking about transitioning. you still didn't answer the primary question: why would people not want to trade in your imagined society?
And like I've said before, barter is not market exchange.
skills for things, like we do now in the current system
do you know why money came to existence?
Because the people that decided to build the society hate a market exchange system lol
(or do I have to fill in some gaps there too, hope not)
Because states wanted money as a representation of gold in order to pay soldiers to rape and pillage lol
again, the 'market exchange' is just the phenomenon of people wanting to trade, because they have something they want to sell, and the want something they don't
you can call whatever you want it, but trade happens on the market
In my example, people wouldn't want to sell... they would have an entire new social relation, something like a gift economy perhaps?
No, not all trade happens on the market. Only trade using market exchange occurs on the market.
sorry I'll have to give up on you. firstly, because I have no time to debate, secondly because you're missing basic concepts of why people do what they do. I don't have time for this. was great knowing that some can be this off-based of reality though... ttyl
I'll make this more simple. I don't buy the idea that buying and selling or even bartering is integral to human nature.
Go back to the Matrix, see ya my dude.
T shirt design is in production, i just want my own copy to make sure the quality is good before i make it available
@Happy Humble Hermit What are the designs looking like?
@Seven Of Swords one of them involves a samurai character
With the mgtow logo hidden in the background so its not so obvious
Nice
Samurai are badass