but do you agree it's the truth or not?

which taxation is theft or god doesnt exist?

i assume the first one

Well the first one, but you can argue the second one, as well, if you choose.

well i would rather enjoy that, but yes i agree with the first premise tentatively, i do not belive it is enough to argue against the pragmatic arguement

but if you set asside the pragmatic argument

would you agree that taxation is theft?

yes ignoring that context

because I think any appropriation of property without consent is theft.

important point is consent

i agree to an extent

but people don't consent to taxation

they don't consent to murder laws either

But you can't murder someone without running into their right to own their own life

nor do people consent to laws against speeding

therefore murder is inherently wrong

that doesnt affect anyones rights

I would say speeding laws are inherently unethical to some degree

I would disagree and agree to some ammount

I see the argument for both on speeding

I guess you could say knowingly putting someone's life at risk is an unethical thing to do

But I would ask you this what right do you have to drive on a road u didn’t build

It’s not your property

well I'd say the government had no right to use my money to build that road

it's not the government's property either

all of the government's land and property was stolen

what is the government @AiarUther

The infrastructure sure but the land itself wasn’t

yes it was, most nations arbitrarily draw up lines on the map

if I draw a line on a map around your property and write "mine" on it, does that make it mine?

if I then proceed to evict you from that house with threats of violence, does it become mine?

Even if it isn’t the governments property it is someone’s besides yourself so are you not trespassing every time you drive

well presumably, a company that builds roads would want people to drive on them, in order to make money back on their investment

Ok fair enough for toll roads but most aren’t toll roads

why can't all roads be toll roads?

If you account for gas tax, technically they are.

Is that different from taxation?

Well it is

it's voluntary, at least

so it is

It is more usury