Message from @Kscope
Discord ID: 478710123217420299
I test it out, because I've incorporated it. But I test it out against people *who actually disagree*
That is impossible to fully do
It invites your own bias with no real disagreement
Correct, but in a general sense when working within our knowledge structure I would argue that it is impossible to detach yourself from your own subjective reality, and as such you will have blind spots in relation to your opinions
The way to correct these blind spots is by testing your ideas through discourse
k, but why argue with your homonculus, when I can just argue actual people?
The stakes are better, too, because if I can convince someone with a REAL opinion, then I *know* my argument and opinion is good.
homonculus, havent heard that one in a while lol
I was meaning the *testing arguements in private*
When I said correct I was referring to your first statement
If you are debating someone and change their point of view thats the point of a debate
To challenge each others thought process and rational
Yes, I agree
My only criticism was the in private bit. The rest I agree with
It's a tactic I've picked up, to try and destroy my own arguments
In regards to your first statement, I would say thats not necessarily true. When I argue with someone my secondary reason behind debating someone is because I want to convince them of my point of view, however my primary reason is to have the most correct opinion possible within the bounds of my knowledge structure
Unless you meant in private with someone else. And not by yourself
Btw when I say first statement I meant the one where you said
*If you are debating someone and change their point of view thats the point of a debate*
Debating yourself only reinforces bias, poor discussion, bad sources, and blond spots.
Now a mock debate would make sense
One person playing devils advocate to explore the point of view and rational for said misgivings
Thats what I assume he means but I'd like confirmation on that
@Kscope That's what you offered to do. Hold a different opinion other than your own. It's a 'fake' opinion, and you're not engaged with it
Playing devils advocate is fine with risk assessment, and shit, sure
But like "Gay marriage"?
So just to be clear, when you say fake opinion you don't mean strawman of a position, but devils advocate while taking the strongest opinion possible on a the position you're defending
Yes. I'd rather just find someone who actually believes himself.
That is a strong debate training tactic tho @Fitzydog that is debate training and devils advocate. In most topics the oponents opinions are known. So having someone use those talking points while disecting your own is highly useful.
But its usually a tactic for a professional debate tbh
@Goblin_Slayer_Floki Yes, I know. I consider that shit to be like mental masturbation.
"How can I better trick my opponent with debate tactics"
Given that my primary reasoning for engaging in a debate is to have the most correct opinion possible, playing devils advocate helps strengthen my knowledge of the opposing sides view while also possibly introducing me to more arguments in favor/against my original stance
Its been used by debators, lawyers, ect for a long time. Cant be to bad a tactic.
Also I dont know what you mean by mental masturbation, can you define it and why you think its bad?
No its more the devils advocate can question statements in ways your oponents would. As to allow you to see blind spots in your debate
> playing devils advocate helps strengthen my knowledge of the opposing sides
Not as well as the real thing, because YOU don't have all the knowledge of the opposing side. *The opposing side does.*
mental masturbation is being a faggot in the view of others
@Fitzydog again, thats not neccessarily true
Do you need me to give you an example in which this is not neccessarily true?
It's the difference between sparring, and an actual fight.