What about if value of labor is actually determined by the supply of those workers and the demand for those workers

<:GWcfcThonk:357907199928041473>

as well as the labor used in intermediate commodities that are then assembled by the machines

How is this any different than just saying price?

What about when there is no labor

You are equivocating price and value

when is there ever no labor?

Because price is the practical form of value

Even the air your breathing right now takes a little bit of labor

Value doesnt mean anything

Contradiciton

If i have an automated factory

how can price be the form of value but value not mean anything?

That will run effectively forever

sure

Is the price of that good free?

Do you ever need to repair or replace the machines?

No

They are self repairing

Now id wager

so let's Steelman this experiment, and make you God. You can manifest anything you wish, break the laws of conservation of energy, etc.

And let's give this ability to everyone

That the value of the good is based on the power and capital needed to produce it, plus the time value and convienience

And then ask, what is the price of some random thing on the market

Nothing

why?

Because you have no capital needed to make anything. Everyone can make anything

define capital?

Investment needed to get more money

Or capital

If im a working class i can save the capital i earn to create more capital

Then i could make my own business

Employ other people

And if everyone did that?

Where would you get the people to employ?

if everyone became some small shop owner.

what do you think would happen to your labor pool

There will always be people just starting out

Young people

Young people make up how much of the population

And there will always be people not good enough to escape the working class